Stuck spindle in a bottom bracket

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cman said:
No buddy needed...unless he is there for moral support. Always bolt the BB tool in place. Allow only a tick of wiggle room. You may have to loosen the bolt set up as you undo the BB. This method also allows you to place the tool in a vice and turns your frame into the wrench.

Bottom_bracket_key_mounted_on_bracket_cartridge.jpg
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That's good, although @us56456712 's BB unit has a female-threaded spindle, so it'd need a bolt plus washers and a nut... but the concept is the same. I like it.

So, @us56456712 , what kind of frame is this?
 
SILVERKINGPC said:
Big mistake. Try taking out the still-good steel side (non-drive) by trying a clockwise. then counter. See if it moves. I looked once more at your problem frame, and it looks like the drive side of the bb was installed into the non-drive side, destroying the BB threads, and possibly the frames threads as well.
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I didn't catch this at first. Looks like a cheaper Shimano BB (CS,LP). I have seen them come through the bike coop and always throws everyone for a loop. They are "reversed" in that the fixed cup goes on the left side (right hand thread). All the UN bottom brackets have fixed on the right side (Left Hand thread).

More here on pages 2 and 3. http://brown-snout.com/cycling/tech/barnetts/barnetts_ch10.pdf
 
Bicycle808 said:
That's good, although @us56456712 's BB unit has a female-threaded spindle, so it'd need a bolt plus washers and a nut... but the concept is the same. I like it.

So, @us56456712 , what kind of frame is this?
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It is a Gary Fisher. It's light like my early 1990 rigid Cromo Giant. It's a beautiful frame. I am not sure of the vintage but it's probably 1990s. Nice welds, extremely light steel. I have a canti very light Cromo Tange MB fork from the 1990s I would like to use with it. I also have a very light 3 arm 50 x 40 crank from the 1960s I would like to use. I have 2 sets of 1.5 1970s Araya rims and I plan to make them tubeless (tired of pinch flats). I would like to use a carbon seat and alloy riser bars. I have heavy duty MB brake levers from the early 80s and old (I think) Shimano canti brakes shaped like a triangle. I also have several drum brakes and I am thinking about adding a little extra weight and building a rear wheel with a 6 speed cluster. I would like to build this up as a rigid cross country race bike. Our local short MB race (28 miles) has a lot of flats and gravel washboard roads. There is no way I could win the 70 to 120 year old group with any bike as there is a guy that is 6'4" and is made out of muscle and gristle and has a personal trainer. He gets faster every year and the 30 year olds can't keep up with him. He has a full blown race bike and wins the class by a mile. I have an early 1980s MB crank with 3 chain wheels but the small sprocket is still quite large. I really need a vintage crank with a smaller chain wheel for the steeper sections. With the gearing I have I will have to push. About 30 years ago I made one of these 3 arm cranks into a single speed and bolted on a small chain wheel to the 3 arms. I cut off the large sprocket and mounted the chain wheel to the 3 arms. I can't remember how I did this. It worked though. I might try and do something like this with it. Years ago these cranks were everywhere but now I am reluctant to ruin one with an experiment. I won't be doing any of this if I can't get it apart.
 
It's really stuck. I used a sledge hammer and supported the BB with a 1 1/16 socket. The socket is chewed up and the BB is flattened. It moved a little but is stuck. I tried to move it the other way, no dice. I used two sockets to make a press and hammered the vice tight with the sledge hammer until stuff started to jump off the bench and onto the floor. Its a heavy duty quality vice, but I didn't want to bend the clamp lever or break the vice. Won't move either way. Holy wah! What gives with this thing? You can see where the right side of the picture the BB is wowed out from all the pounding, sparks flying. I tried it both ways. It moved a little out the right side of the picture but now won't mover either way. Next step might be to cut the whole BB out and weld in a new one. That probably wouldn't be much more time consuming than what I already tried. I'm the third owner of this thing to try and remove it. Bike shop, co-op and me. Everything has been tried, wrench with 4 foot leverage, penetrating oil, heat, impact wrench and pounding. I have a large impact drill. I wonder what would happen if I clamped one end of the spindle into my vice and tried to drill it out with my 3/4 or 5/8 inch carbide tipped masonry bits? If it worked at all it would take forever.
 
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Maybe you could make a long horizontal cut with a hacksaw, either the whole length or only the threaded ends and split it slightly with a cold chisel - just enough to get the thread to release ?
 
Try reversing the frame in the vise and try again--this time driving the guts out through the plastic collar, rather than the metal one. Make sure the socket is deep enough to allow adequate movement. If you can succeed in driving the internal parts out, you'll gain enough access to grind on the steel collar, weakening it. Be patient...our last stuck BB took us six-weeks to remove.

 
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If that is an LP or CS bottom bracket then you may be able to disassemble as they are rebuildable. It looks to be one of these models since the metal flange(fixed cup) is on the non-drive side. This video explains how to disassemble without using force with written description below video. You could then remove the cups separately.

 
I am a proponent of clamping the tool against the BB to keep it from slipping just as you are. That's the only way I got one out that was stuck. Impact wrench didn't work for me either.

HOWEVER:

I think you are going over-board with the vice. If you tightened it as much as you say you did, there is no way that the threads could move out of the BB against the vice jaw. You have it trapped completely. JMHO. Also you must make the frame immovable in some fashion. The only thing that should be able to move should be the threaded shell. Best of luck. I hate these situations.
 
Bicycle808 said:
That's good, although @us56456712 's BB unit has a female-threaded spindle, so it'd need a bolt plus washers and a nut... but the concept is the same. I like it.

So, @us56456712 , what kind of frame is this?
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Gary Fisher Rangitoto. Don't know the year. It is reputed to have had excellent frame geometry and light weight with junk components. All the previous frame owners wanted to build it up but could not get the BB apart. Grrr.
 
jerrykr said:
I am a proponent of clamping the tool against the BB to keep it from slipping just as you are. That's the only way I got one out that was stuck. Impact wrench didn't work for me either.

HOWEVER:

I think you are going over-board with the vice. If you tightened it as much as you say you did, there is no way that the threads could move out of the BB against the vice jaw. You have it trapped completely. JMHO. Also you must make the frame immovable in some fashion. The only thing that should be able to move should be the threaded shell. Best of luck. I hate these situations.
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I tried the nut and a 4 foot extension on the wrench. It didn't move. A seal from each side came out with the pounding and the spindle moved a 1/4 inch but that is it. It still spins and the cups are in place, screwed into the frame. I tried drilling to destroy the cups but that didn't work. I can see bearings now but no nut to disassemble it. I know people have pounded these apart before. According to what I found on the net it should pound apart easier. One of the local bike shops pounds them apart as a last resort and then cuts out the races. So far the frame is OK.
I need to add a few more feet to this flow chart that indicates the blocked logic gates, dah!
 
Maybe a skilled application of a cutting torch could work to remove the guts of the bearing on 1 side and let the shaft fall out. Then cut the threaded cups and remove with a cold chisel. You may have to use a small tip and wrap the frame area with damp rags to control the heat.
The trick sometimes is to weeken threaded parts then crack them in two to remove em'. :D
 
horsefarmer said:
Maybe a skilled application of a cutting torch could work to remove the guts of the bearing on 1 side and let the shaft fall out. Then cut the threaded cups and remove with a cold chisel. You may have to use a small tip and wrap the frame area with damp rags to control the heat.
The trick sometimes is to weeken threaded parts then crack them in two to remove em'. :D
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I could use more heat than before because almost all of the plastic sleeve has been drilled out.
 
Angle grinder and chisel?
 

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