The pleasure of the coaster brake, any converted road bikes?

[xray]

I was recently given a newer Schwinn cruiser that has the old school frame and balloon tires with a 3 speed Nexus hub and coaster brake. I've really enjoyed riding this bike around the neighborhood. It's very flat here, so 3 speeds are adequate. The surprise for me is the coaster brake.

I'm gonna ask a question, but I'll preface it with some info on why I ask.

It has been decades since I rode a bike with a good coaster brake, and I don't think I ever rode one with both internal gearing and a coaster brake. I was kind of shocked how well this Nexus hub works. I haven't logged a lot of miles on it, but the sensation of using the coaster brake is very gratifying somehow.

I've been messing with an old Schwinn Varsity, got it super cleaned up and put back together. It works nice, but I'm thinking of replacing the wheels, so while I'm at it, I'm going to put on a rear wheel with a 3 speed coaster hub and get rid of the hand brakes, the derailleurs, etc. I'll take off the larger chain ring and just run it as a 3 speed. With no rim brakes I can cram larger tires into the frame, and I'll probably use cream colored tires for the heck of it. I've seen a couple of bikes where people have used a diamond frame with fatter tires and flat bars to a very nice effect.

I am not real practical about bikes. I tend to buy a $50 bike, put $200 or $300 into it, and still have a $50 bike when I'm done tweaking and modifying. I really don't care to discuss the practicality of it - we often see threads where two out of three replies are saying "it's not worth the money, why don't you just buy a bike set up that way?"

Because - that's why. This forum wouldn't exist at all if everybody just did the cheap, easy thing instead of the thing that they just wanted to do. (Or HAD to do, because it was just a compulsion to make something.)

I've also got a mountain/comfort hybrid sort of bike with a Nexus 8 speed hub. I enjoy that bike as well. I had a bike with the Alfine 11 speed hub for a while and liked that. The 8 speed is available with a coaster brake - the 11 speed is not.

SO:

Question 1: Has anybody else converted old road bikes to internal hub cruisers? (And of course, how about telling all about it?)

I'm interested in 3 speeds, 3 speeds with coaster brakes, and all different kinds of internal geared conversions - it doesn't have to be any particular type.

Question 2: Shimano makes an 8 speed coaster brake hub. With my new found love of coaster brakes, that sounds to me like an extremely attractive piece of equipment, so WHY are there no popular brand/model bikes being sold with such a set-up? Is this perhaps not such a reliable piece of hardware? Is it just the price point that bike makers are calculating - how much customers will pay for this vs. the profitable price objective?

You know - 9 out of 10 people are buying bikes that aren't right for them. How many people really need 20-plus speeds and a suspension fork? Would it not be a really practical bike for a huge percentage of consumers, having 8 speeds and a coaster brake?

 

[peejus]

I was recently given a newer Schwinn cruiser that has the old school frame and balloon tires with a 3 speed Nexus hub and coaster brake. I've really enjoyed riding this bike around the neighborhood. It's very flat here, so 3 speeds are adequate. The surprise for me is the coaster brake.

I'm gonna ask a question, but I'll preface it with some info on why I ask.

It has been decades since I rode a bike with a good coaster brake, and I don't think I ever rode one with both internal gearing and a coaster brake. I was kind of shocked how well this Nexus hub works. I haven't logged a lot of miles on it, but the sensation of using the coaster brake is very gratifying somehow.

I've been messing with an old Schwinn Varsity, got it super cleaned up and put back together. It works nice, but I'm thinking of replacing the wheels, so while I'm at it, I'm going to put on a rear wheel with a 3 speed coaster hub and get rid of the hand brakes, the derailleurs, etc. I'll take off the larger chain ring and just run it as a 3 speed. With no rim brakes I can cram larger tires into the frame, and I'll probably use cream colored tires for the heck of it. I've seen a couple of bikes where people have used a diamond frame with fatter tires and flat bars to a very nice effect.

I am not real practical about bikes. I tend to buy a $50 bike, put $200 or $300 into it, and still have a $50 bike when I'm done tweaking and modifying. I really don't care to discuss the practicality of it - we often see threads where two out of three replies are saying "it's not worth the money, why don't you just buy a bike set up that way?"

Because - that's why. This forum wouldn't exist at all if everybody just did the cheap, easy thing instead of the thing that they just wanted to do. (Or HAD to do, because it was just a compulsion to make something.)

I've also got a mountain/comfort hybrid sort of bike with a Nexus 8 speed hub. I enjoy that bike as well. I had a bike with the Alfine 11 speed hub for a while and liked that. The 8 speed is available with a coaster brake - the 11 speed is not.

SO:

Question 1: Has anybody else converted old road bikes to internal hub cruisers? (And of course, how about telling all about it?)

I'm interested in 3 speeds, 3 speeds with coaster brakes, and all different kinds of internal geared conversions - it doesn't have to be any particular type.

Question 2: Shimano makes an 8 speed coaster brake hub. With my new found love of coaster brakes, that sounds to me like an extremely attractive piece of equipment, so WHY are there no popular brand/model bikes being sold with such a set-up? Is this perhaps not such a reliable piece of hardware? Is it just the price point that bike makers are calculating - how much customers will pay for this vs. the profitable price objective?

You know - 9 out of 10 people are buying bikes that aren't right for them. How many people really need 20-plus speeds and a suspension fork? Would it not be a really practical bike for a huge percentage of consumers, having 8 speeds and a coaster brake?

You are pretty much describing an English 3 speed club bike type of bike.

I have a german one that has a sachs 3 speed with a coaster brake, and a royce union with a sturmy archer 3 speed with rim brakes.

I call them commuter bikes... the Toyota corrolla of the city bike world.

That's not meant as a insult to the bikes.. i love them, they are just bullet proof, old school bikes that just have a nice even ride.



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[xray]

Yeah, close enough... Take an old English 3 speed, add flat bars, take off the fenders, give it fatter tires, and it's basically the same thing.

But, I'm wondering if anyone here has done anything creative or slightly different with the basic idea?

 

[peejus]

Yeah.. thats what begat the modern road bike.. folks just kept hot rodding out the concept.

But, i see no problem building a three speed coaster hub in to a skinny tire racing bike frame and rims... might take custom spokes though.

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[Danssoslow]

I don't know if this fits what you are talking about completely, but it is a bit different and involves a internally geared hub.

I am working on attaching a second hub gear on my Sturmey Archer trike 5 speed hub, so that I can run a differential rear axle.

 

[xray]

Custom spokes? As long as the hub fits between the dropouts I don't see how the spokes would differ.

For the current project, I just bought a 26 inch wheelset with the 3 speed coaster hub to replace the 27 inch original wheels. Since I'm not using rim brakes, the different wheel size won't be a problem. The clearance is going to be a little tight on the sides - I'm just waiting for the tires to arrive.

I was hoping to see pix of any similar builds.

I'd be interested in hearing about the trike - I also have a number of trikes. If I understand that you are trying to add a second hub - trying to create some sort of differential arrangement - sounds interesting, but probably deserves a thread of its own.

 

[Wildcat]

To answer question one, I've used 3 brands of 3 speed hubs with coaster brakes on diamond frames, and a couple of two speed with coaster hubs also. These two are are a 71 Varsity and a 65 Continental. I used 26" wheels with 2 inch and 1.95 width tires. That's the fattest I could go. If I went with 27" wheels they would have to be narrower to clear the stays in the rear, maybe 1.75. This is for the old Schwinn frames, others may be narrower.

For question two, I think the internal geared hub is more costly than the derailleur setup. I thought the 2 speed kickback with coaster brake would be more popular, no cables or anything.

 

[Wildcat]

A side note, SRAM has the Automatix 2 speed with coaster, but also makes a 3 speed auto with coaster brake that is only available on their world bikes, which we can't get yet. I'm hoping it is working out okay and is available to the public soon.

 

[xray]

Wildcat, thanks... exactly the kind of response I was hoping for, that's very helpful. The pix are great, and your experience with the tire sizes is informative.

Unfortunately, since I am awaiting delivery of a pair of Rubena City Hopper 26 x 2.0 tires, I may be disappointed to find that they are a tad too fat! I figured anything larger would be too big, but I had trouble coming up with cream colored tires that fit the rims and the frame. I found 1 3/8 tires which were too narrow for the 1.75-2.15 rims, and I found a few different 2.15 to 2.35 and even larger cream colored tires.

Did you acquire these frames with the cranks shown or, I'm guessing you replaced original ten speed cranks with these? These single chain ring cranks are the reason I have been looking for Collegiate and other 5 speed frames, but I have seen a supplier selling this type of crank and chain ring as well.

Your bikes both have the frame height I like best, in terms of appearance - the distance between top and down tubes.

Very clean and simple... thanks. I realize there are probably thousands of old Varsity and Collegiate bikes running around in similarly stripped down configurations - what I'm doing with this is not original or radical.

As to the internal hub being more expensive, that's probably the bottom line. People might pay a little more if they realized the benefits, but the bike industry makes more money making the cheaper derailleur seem like the more desirable product. It probably is in some cases, like people who actually ride hilly country and long distances, but the internal geared hub has its advantages for other kinds of riding.

 

[squirreldh]

I am a huge fan of internal hubs, have rebuilt almost every internal out there. They are great for commuters, 3spds in particular for generally flat areas, i live in Denver and love them for getting around town. The simplicity of a single speed chain and no derailleurs is hard to beat on a commuter, especially in winter when snow and ice will clog a traditional cassette and render your derailleur useless. Only issues are weight and durability, they thend to be heavy, especially when given enough speeds to compete with modern derailleur equipped bicycles, check out the Rohlhoff hub for instance, 14spds! And the small gears and cogs inside tend to wear from heavy pedalling and abuse, shimano nexus are notorious for failing under hard use like offroad riding and popping wheelies! If you really want to see a cool internal hub, check out the NuVinci hub, a really cool CVT type drive that was released about 10yrs ago.

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[xray]

I'd love to put a Rohloff in an old Collegiate frame, but here's the problem. I am definitely the guy who will spend $300 on a $50 bike to have a little fun. I'm NOT the guy who will spend $1300 on a $50 bike. If I found a Rohloff at a garage sale for $50, I'd be all for it.

I have been watching the NuVinci for years, very cool. If anyone is still unaware of it, it is a continuously variable (infinitely variable) hub that gives about 360% gearing variation. There aren't "speeds" per se, you just tweak it up and down in whatever increment you like. Like the very pricey Rohloff it is also heavy. I personally don't care about weight, within practical limits. I ride for exercise, and for fun within a limited neighborhood that it always nice to ride around it, sightseeing: which tropical birds are here this week?

I've seen a Dahon Mu with a Nuvinci, and a mid drive electric bike that was running the motor drive through the Nuvinci. It's definitely a magnet for people who like to put together less conventional bikes. My current fascination with the Nexus 8 is that it can be had with a coaster brake. I don't think you can get that in the Nuvinci or Rohloff, the latter of which is outside my budget anyway. I understand that the Nuvinci has proven more reliable and durable than skeptic predicted, but I'll have to go back and check that.

I've ridden a couple of them, and never quite grasped it. There's something reassuring about having only 3 speeds, or 8, or some fixed number. You shift gears, and you feel a definite gear ratio in the drive train. With the Nuvinci, for me and in only a couple of short trial rides, I had this eery sense that no matter how far or how slightly I changed gears, I could have tweaked it to just another fine increment and gotten a better feel. It's kinda like a restaurant with three choices on the menu, it's easier to pick something than one with 100 items. I am sure that a very technical, disciplined rider who works at a certain cadence could benefit from infinite variability. Me? Even on my 8 speed bike, I probably only use 4 or 5 of the 8 gears. I use all 3 on my 3 speed. The 8 speed leaves me some sense that there's still some place to go, up or down, in the unlikely case that I need to.

Almost anything that is not made specifically for hard off road abuse, or at least way over engineered for casual street riding, riding will break under those conditions.

I once read a complaint about the Alfine 11 speed hub, where the guy reviewing it said that it was dangerous. He blamed the hub for a situation where he fell off the bike in the middle of an intersection, because he was standing up, pedaling very hard to beat the light, and shifted gears. The hub slipped, letting the pedals suddenly spin free, and down he went like stepping off a cliff.

He should not have been riding like that. He should have known the limits of the equipment. If you stand up and pedal hard while shifting, this is exactly what you should expect. It's a matter of operator error. Complaining about that is like complaining that your brakeless high geared urban fixie is hard to ride up a mountain and hard to stop coming back down when you're riding in flip flops.

 

[franconuevo]

Not so much with road bikes..but mountain bikes make excellent single speeds...and if you can get rid of the knobby tires it's even better. I like to use a coaster brake with a front hand brake,smooth rides and you don't have to look between your legs to see what's hanging up your rear shifter all the time.
Occasionally , here in Fla. there are some folks that find a random hill or two..and want a geared bike..(just sold a 95 TREK) mountain bike yesterday, matter of fact
But, I just strip off the unnecessary parts and put on whatever is laying around..I don't buy a new part other than a tube or tire now and then..just go to the parts boxes from donors....currently out of any coaster brake hubs, and out of single speed freewheels but, here is a Roadmaster mtn bike stripped of dérailleurs, and decals.. with a home made spacer deal SS cog goin on..can't see the PVC pipe I cut and space out on the other side of cog.just finished this up yesterday too..but, it''s actually bikes like this one that I use for my own riders around these parts...

and...I have converted a Road Bike into a Muscle Bike with a 3 speed freewheel, but that's a different story...

oh , someone was asking what we do with BO bikes..happy to say I had the Unvega out for quite a while yesterday...a girl and her BF drove up over an hour to pick up another bike they wanted...but wanted to take a ride on the Univega. she was smiling ear to ear..what fun....Damm, that was a fun build off...
franco

 

[us56456712]

1940 Schwinn DX, 2 speed coaster brake

 

[us56456712]

1940 Snyder with Nexus 3 speed.

 

[Wildcat]

"Unfortunately, since I am awaiting delivery of a pair of Rubena City Hopper 26 x 2.0 tires, I may be disappointed to find that they are a tad too fat! I figured anything larger would be too big, but I had trouble coming up with cream colored tires that fit the rims and the frame. I found 1 3/8 tires which were too narrow for the 1.75-2.15 rims, and I found a few different 2.15 to 2.35 and even larger cream colored tires.

Did you acquire these frames with the cranks shown or, I'm guessing you replaced original ten speed cranks with these? These single chain ring cranks are the reason I have been looking for Collegiate and other 5 speed frames, but I have seen a supplier selling this type of crank and chain ring as well."

The 1 3/8ths is a different diameter, for the skinny 26" rim. Doesn't make sense but that's how it works. Schwinn had a different 26" wheel also, the S-7 wheel. It was a tiny bit larger in diameter so nothing but a higher priced Schwinn tire would fit it. My dad used to do a lot of cussing when he changed tires on my brothers and my bikes back in the day, when an S-7 rim came into play.
I think the 2" tire will fit the bike, as long as it's a good straight rim. If you need just a tiny bit more room, the old steel frame can be carefully tweaked to make it work. I've done it with a piece of 2 x 4 cut to the width I wanted and then hammered it between the stays right where the tire will go, then squeezed the dropouts where the hub bolts up to the right width for the hub. Carefully and little by little until it clears is paramount.
On the yellow Varsity, I had a complete 10 speed before I modified it. Someone wanted it, it went back to original and the cranks were used on the bare frame Continental.
There's another internal geared hub I just remembered. Trek Lime, about 8 years ago, had a 3 speed w coaster that used electrical input from the front hub to shift at certain speeds that you set. I don't know who made the hubs. It's got the big chrome caps on the hubs. One of the members here used a set of those on a build a few years back.

 

[Wildcat]

Another consideration is the pedal height, they will be a little closer to the ground with a 26" wheel, if the frame came with 27" wheels. I never had a problem with scraping when leaning into turn, but I always went easy in the corners because I knew they were about 1/2" or so closer. I had a Racer that really worked well with a 3 speed, but it came new with 26".

 

[Wildcat]

"These single chain ring cranks are the reason I have been looking for Collegiate and other 5 speed frames, but I have seen a supplier selling this type of crank and chain ring as well."

These are from a one speed bike, that's the type that will go with the internal geared hubs, so you can grab any one speed old Schwinn from the scrap pile and make it work.

 

[franconuevo]

I've settled on a 26 x 1.95 tire for Mtn. Bike to SS conversions. I either have a few street tires, smooth tread kicking around or I'll buy a pair from , I don't know EBuy or biketiredirect. or just put on a pair of worn smoothed down mtn. bike tires. Always an excellent enjoyable ride.
I know a lot of folks are sold on beach cruisers or fatty tires, but personally, I find them sloggish to steer with... That Roadmaster above really moves nice and smooth...you gotta tinker with the ratio I have that at 48T / 21 T, and it's good. But eventually I'll swap it out for a 'real' 20 tooth freewheel, that's better.
But yeah, older Collegiates are great for parts...

 

[GuitarlCarl]

Sounds like an early "Klunker" to me, even though I wouldn't ride them too hard or competitively anymore. I love coasters with 3 speeds because of all the points listed above... ease of use and a fair gear range. Folks have noted the weight difference, but I'm not so sure a dérailleur gear and a stack of cogs on a hub weigh much less than a simple 3 speed coaster, and if I was really worried about it wouldn't I slow down on the cheeseburgers?
So a cool older frame, a diamond if you like, add a coaster wheel because they're easy, and roll on brother. I have an old Sears frame just waiting to be rebuilt, sporting eccentric rims right now...

We be cruisin', me I'm 50+ so cruisin' is just fine. Biggest problem I have is remembering which brakes I have when I first get on a bike because I own many of both styles...

Carl.

 

[Wildcat]

franconuevo's blue bike shows a 3 piece set of cranks. While the old Varsitys have one piece cranks, and you don't mind spending a little, it's good to get the conversion that will make it 3 piece. You have more choices in cranks and chain rings, plus it rides better imo.

Here's a vid showing installation in a frame like yours: