Sturmey Archer X-FD

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Building up a set of bomber/klunker wheels and like the idea and look of a front drum. Does anyone have any experience with the X-FD? Probably won't descend Mt. Tam, but will get some local NC trail use/abuse. Any input would be appreciated. Thanks!

Frank
 
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It's an X-FD, for the record. I have a few. Great hub for klunking, but it will get hot on long descents, and the brake will fade when it's hot. The pads are costly to replace, and finding the pads for sale separately is hard, but the pads last basically forever. The sealed bearings have lasted me a long time, too... still smooth as butter. Things to keep in mind, as far as build considerations:

-brake arm clips come in two sizes: 7/8" and 17.5mm. The hub ships with the 7/8" clip. You can use a hose clamp to secure the brake arm if you're running a fatter fork.
-if i could do it again, i'd have laced it 2-cross in my 26" wheel. The flanges are about 90mm in diameter, so the angles are a bit drastic with the 3-cross, but it worked.
-if i could do it again, i'd have gone with the xl-fd for klunkin', b/c it has a 90mm drum, vs the 70mm drum on the x-fd. The flange diameter for these is 109mm, so definitely go 2-cross when lacing it up.
-I don't care what you might see or read on the internet; these brakes work best with short-pull levers (bmx, road, old Weinmann-type levers, mtb levers for cantilevers are good.) If you run long-pull levers-- mtb levers for v-brakes or mech disc-- the brakes will squeal and perform weird and you'll bust the brake plate. BMX levers tend to have a good feel and good performance for a klunker build. Old mtb levers from the canti days worm nice, too, and have that 4-finger moto look, if that appeals to ya....

hth
-Rob
 
It's an X-FD, for the record. I have a few. Great hub for klunking, but it will get hot on long descents, and the brake will fade when it's hot. The pads are costly to replace, and finding the pads for sale separately is hard, but the pads last basically forever. The sealed bearings have lasted me a long time, too... still smooth as butter. Things to keep in mind, as far as build considerations:

-brake arm clips come in two sizes: 7/8" and 17.5mm. The hub ships with the 7/8" clip. You can use a hose clamp to secure the brake arm if you're running a fatter fork.
-if i could do it again, i'd have laced it 2-cross in my 26" wheel. The flanges are about 90mm in diameter, so the angles are a bit drastic with the 3-cross, but it worked.
-if i could do it again, i'd have gone with the xl-fd for klunkin', b/c it has a 90mm drum, vs the 70mm drum on the x-fd. The flange diameter for these is 109mm, so definitely go 2-cross when lacing it up.
-I don't care what you might see or read on the internet; these brakes work best with short-pull levers (bmx, road, old Weinmann-type levers, mtb levers for cantilevers are good.) If you run long-pull levers-- mtb levers for v-brakes or mech disc-- the brakes will squeal and perform weird and you'll bust the brake plate. BMX levers tend to have a good feel and good performance for a klunker build. Old mtb levers from the canti days worm nice, too, and have that 4-finger moto look, if that appeals to ya....

hth
-Rob
Excellent bunch of info there Rob, thanks. Never have laced up a larger flanged hub, I wouldn't have thought about two cross. Definitely will go that direction.
It may be just for insurance/liability purposes, but the main reason I was asking about functionality is because their website has the X-FD for "road use" only. It will be nice to have a drum brake that functions well, while holding true to the aesthetic of the klunker/bomber (haven't made up my mind yet, but probably the later) build. Stylish AND functional! Thanks again!
 
I'm happy to help. For whatever it's worth, if you watch "the movie", the Marin guys seemed to consider a Bomber as a singlespeed coaster bike with no other brakes, a Klunker was a singlespeed coaster bike with some kind of auxiliary front hand brake, and a Hybrid was a multispeed conversion with derailer(s) and front/rear hand brakes. Alan Bonds's site, www.clunkers.net, seems to suggest a similar system of nomenclature, although he doesn't offer any cut-n-dry definitions on Klunker taxonomy. As I see it, any time you're riding trails with a frame designed for cruising, but in any way modified for off-road use, you're klunking, on a klunker. The inevitable discussion about the equipment you're running will fill in any blanks about brakes, drivetrain, etc...

I think Sturmey-Archer is worried about liability, and also good ol' fashioned common sense, when they say the x-fd is intended for road use only. A drum certainly isn't a disc; it ain't even a v-brake. The typical Joe Schmoe might not understand that, and Sturmey-Archer probably doesn't want to get into the risk & complication of trying to explain that many dim-bulbs like you and I run drums offroad, and we have adjusted our expectations accordingly. The fact is, if you're the type of person who takes a heavyweight mild steel cruiser frame, hangs a lot of '50's-tech components on it, puts some knobbies on it, and considers running coaster-only, you're absolutely as prepared as you'll ever be to deal with heat-induced brake fade and a general lack of impressive braking power that comes from running a drum offroad. You're also not the type of person Sturmey-Archer and other manufacturers need to educate about "intended use", b/c you're piloting either a 70 year-old newsboy bike or a late-model industrial bike on singletrack, so the notion of "intended use" seems like a low priority. Schwinn of Chicago and other firms like Worksman never intended their bikes to be ridden hard on the trail, but some of us knuckleheads do it anyway.

Like I said before, the power of the X-FD is kinda underwhelming if you're used to discs, and something I forgot to mention before: the first hundred miles, you'll want to unlace the hub and send it back b/c the "power" is comically weak until the pads wear in. In the best conditions, you can tune the drum to work silently, reliably, and with enough braking authority to handily get the job done... You'll need to get the cable tension just right, and you'll need to be running short-pull levers, and you'll want a fairly clean (no sharp turns, few bends) run of housing. (I'm going to upgrade to compressionless housing soon; I was amazed at what that simple mod did for my road calipers, so I'm hoping it'll do something similar for my drums.) If you were white-knuckling downhill in a sustained fashion, the drum will get hot, the lever will feel dead, and braking performance will go down the tubes. Best to lean the bike against a tree, take a pee, and sit on a stump & enjoy nature for a few minutes whilst things cool down. (Incidentally, at this point, your coaster might be even more deserving of a break, and will probably need a repack.) If the drums are honking/ squealing/ squawking when engaged, you've either got something in the drum that you'll need to clean out (h2o, chain oil, mud, squirrels?) or you've got cable tension issues--- time to retune. If it's squealing when you're not squeezing the lever, you got the cable too tight and the pads are dragging... turn the barrel in an 1/8th turn or so.
 
Excellent. X-FD it is. I feel like you should invoice me. Thanks again!
Since I have an old Weinmann brake lever on the shelf, I can cross that off the check list. With so many Schwinns in the Klunker gene pool, I thought I'd throw my Elgin in the mix. 193? motobike frame with the alemite fittings and a chromoly tubed fork. Rear hub will be Bendix Aviator 2spd. Modern hoops ( Sun Rhynolite in silver) for dependability and to cut down some rotating weight, Mr Tick bars shimmed for the Ashtabula stem, Oury grips, and a bottom bracket adapter from Harris Cycle for an 80's era Sugino 3 piece crank. Keeping the 39 tooth up front. Top it off with a well aged Brooks saddle.
I'll start a build thread as soon as I gather the remainder of parts -》Pedals, tires and seat post.)
 
Sounds like a good parts mix.... do yo intend to spread the stem to take those bars? 80s era 3 piece Sugino would prolly be a 52/42, no?
 
And yes, 42 on the ring. Is widening the stem for the cross bar a problem?
Ppl do it all the time. I think i'd do it once and leave it; repeated spreading and retightening is bound to cause metal fatigue, which would be exacerbated by the fact that it's an old part. If the Ashtabula neck seems to be in good shape, and you're pretty sure that's the cockpit you want for the build, I say "go for it", so long as you know that there is some risk damaging or just weakening the stem.
 
FWIW, you can easily find square taper bmx cranks in the 150, 152, and 160mm lengths, and some of them are even cheap.
http://www.niagaracycle.com/categories/bulletproof-bmx-crankarm-set-150mm-110-bcd-forged-silver
These are racing cranks, and personally, i think they're a worse option for klunking than a 1-piece. Lighter, sure, but more prone to failure. It all depends on your riding style, but if you're hard on components, a cheap crank built to be race-light for small riders will probably break sooner rather than later.

Splined-type 3 pieces are much stronger, and manufacturers like Profile make them down to a 145mm length, but the cheaper versions by other makers tend to come in 175 and 180mm versions.

BITD, the MArin guys coveted the model "c" Schwinns b/c they had a higher BB shell; later on, the "c" became the basis for the Cook Bros Racing 26" geometry. BB height is a factor, and higher is better, but whether you have 2" or 3" of clearance at the pedals on the downstroke, you're going to hard-strike if you don't take care in picking lines and know when to coast to sustain "flow". I run 180s on a Worksman, been fine for me. Most times I've hit the pedal to an obstacle, i'd have prolly done the same running 165s under identical circumstances.
 
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