1938-41 Entry level track bike

[us56456712]

• 1938-41 Schwinn New World. I got the frame only but it came with track bars. It had the original New World stem, crank and chainring. I'm going to weld up the forward facing dropouts (it was made to compete with Raleigh so most of them had the forward facing dropouts) to make track drop outs. Not sure about wheels. I have a set but they are 26x1 3/8 and I would like 700c. I'll have to toss on an old set of 700C wheels I have to see how they fit but they should as this bike could be purchased with 700c wood wheels. I would like to use a large flange telephone dial front hub and a skip tooth armless coaster brake for the rear hub. I have two armless coasters so I would have to build these wheels, unless I use my 26 inch ones. These bikes looked like the Paramount and Superior of this vintage as they had the same frame design but were made from heaver tubing and had the 13/16 Schwinn seat post. A lot of these frames had 3 piece cranks with 1/2 inch pedals but mine has a one piece BB and skip tooth drive. I went and started welding up the dropouts but my feet got cold. I figured I would do something the first day.
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
  Last edited: Yesterday at 1:12 PM
  us56456712, Yesterday at 1:07 PMEditDeleteReport
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  RustyGold, metalchewy, macncheese and 4 others like this.

• 
  Falstaff
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  It's only one bike per class.
  
  Falstaff, Yesterday at 1:59 PMReport
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  You like this.

• 
  us56456712
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  ↑
  It's only one bike per class.
  How about I fiddle with all three and see if any of them work out. I have doubts about straightening the 1920s road bike frame so that probably will be eliminated. Then I could see which ones turn out, if any, than enter the one. I could also quit if non work out. I forgot about the one rule but I'll only post one for a vote.
  
  us56456712, Yesterday at 4:03 PMEditDeleteReport
  #3Reply

• 
  us56456712
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  Track drop out conversion needs a lot more flat filing. I may weld on rear entry type drop outs from a kid 20 inch bicycle as reinforcement on the outside of the existing dropouts. Like real track dropouts. Don't know yet.
  
  us56456712, Yesterday at 7:36 PMEditDeleteReport
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  hammer mechanic likes this.

• 
  RustyGold
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  I would think that changing the dropouts could count as enough reason to make it class 2 if you wanted to.
  
  Jason
  
  RustyGold, Today at 4:24 AMReport
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  You like this.

 

[us56456712]

The photos didn't transfer when I moved this from class one to class two.

Welding shut the forward facing dropouts to convert them to track dropouts

Lots more flat filing necessary. I may lap weld, on the outside, cut down and contoured slide outs from a 20 inch bicycle. Like on a track bicycle. I'm not sure yet.

 

[us56456712]

Track style dropouts, slots drilled, ground and filed

back facing slots cut in welded shut forward facing dropouts. A 700C wheel fits just fine so I know I can build 700C wheels for it.

It's straight that way

It's also straight that way

Drop outs from a 20 inch kids bike

20 inch dropouts cut out. They need to be ground and filed smaller than the ones on the frame and lap welded over the outside of the homemade ones.

 

[SSG]

Love these bikes. I think 40' was the first year of the forward facing dropouts. Is the head tube electroforged? You can tell by looking at the inside, the top and bottom tube flow right into the head tube. K serial number might be somewhere 42-44ish.

 

[us56456712]

Love these bikes. I think 40' was the first year of the forward facing dropouts. Is the head tube electroforged? You can tell by looking at the inside, the top and bottom tube flow right into the head tube. K serial number might be somewhere 42-44ish.

It's fillet brazed, not electoforged. I heated up some of the brazing to burn off some stubborn paint and the silver started to bleed up on the top of the brazing. They made the 1938-41 New World with forward facing drops to compete with Raleigh. A few New Worlds did have the old type drops with bolt adjusters, the same as on their 30s-41 cruisers, on the W models. They could also be purchased with Paramount or Superior pedals, stem or hubs. The W series had wood rims and were promoted as entry level racers but they were not really seriously raced. Some W models were for rent at velodromes so people could learn and see if they wanted to get more serious. They had rubber block pedals stock, could be purchased with either pista or road style drops, had 3 racing seat options including a Brooks, and could be purchased with a one piece one inch drive or a 3 piece cottered crank with 1/2 inch drive. The 3 piece crank had 1/2 inch pedals (weird). You could get it with a SA 2 speed, SA 3 speed, coaster brake or with Schwinn side pull brakes. You could get it with a track fixed gear hub or a freewheel hub. Most were sold to compete with the Raleigh roadsters and had fenders, chain guard, upright bars and a roadster type seat. I have even seen them with drop bars, racing saddle and a chain guard. You could custom order it. It was not made on the production floor but was made in the specialty shop that made the Paramounts and Superiors, but the New World had heavier inferior tubing. All three models had the same geometry and were fillet brazed by Schwinn's best craftsmen. It's a nice bike but the frames were small, the biggest 19, inches and that is rare. Mine is 19 inches, good thing I'm only 5'8". They are not real sought after, like the Paramounts and Superiors and can be found for a nice price and they made a lot of them. I think the best ones are 1938-41. A good fun bike if you aren't a big person.

 

[LukeTheJoker]

Cool frame and nice work on the dropouts!

 

[OddJob]

Looks like you're 'on track' for a great build!
And, the snow is depleting in the U.P. That's a good sign!

 

[us56456712]

Looks like you're 'on track' for a great build!
And, the snow is depleting in the U.P. That's a good sign!

Yes, the snow is slowly going away. It's mostly gone now. On Friday I saw a huge front end loader with 4 foot wheels pushing back snowbanks to make more parking room. There is still al lot of pushing through snow in the shaded areas of the bike trails and there is ice and mud on the roads that were used for snowmobiling but there is plenty of gravel and 2 tracks that are clear and dry for riding. We have the 3 days in the last two weeks where it did get into the 60F. Problem is it is cold at night and it takes most of the day for it to warm up so the snow is persistent this year. In the last 5 years we have had snow still in the woods on Jun1 and the beaches full of floating ice in the Harbor on Lake Superior on Memorial Day. There is still a lot of shore ice and floaters on Lake Superior. My father recalled fishing on Lake Superior in the 1930s and that year there was ice still ice on Lake Superior on the 4th of July. My young family and I went on vacation on Memorial Day and in the morning, 135 miles west, everything was white with snow. I didn't want to get up to pack the tent up.

 

[us56456712]

I think the drops are good enough. They could use more grinding and filing but I'm tired of that. Next step is paint.
Left side

Right side

 

[SSG]

Those track style ends turned out real nice.

 

[LukeTheJoker]

Nice work!

 

[us56456712]

It got up to 60 F (16 C) today but at night it has been in the 30 F. Night temperatures will remain in the 30s F (2-3 C) for the extended 14 day forecast so I still don't feel comfortable painting. It should be a simple build once it's painted and the wheels are done. I could try and put 3 inch wide tires on it just for the challenge. I have a set of 3 inch wide city tires I could try out?

 

[us56456712]

I attempted to make a water bottle holder. It's too long so the bottom has to be cut off and welded to make it shorter. It's made from two thrift store candle holders cut and welded together.

 

[us56456712]

I fixed my homemade bottle holder to fit the bike and bottle. I'm trying out a quilless stem by using a jam nut that is fixed from the bottom of the fork tube. I have pounded the stem onto the jam nut but any tightening pulls it out, instead of into the gooseneck. I need some kind of expanding jam nut. Any ideas? Otherwise I'll have to go back to the traditional stem with the top mounted quill bolt. I like the look but can't figure out how to mount it without a quill.

 

[SpikeFC]

I fixed my homemade bottle holder to fit the bike and bottle. I'm trying out a quilless stem by using a jam nut that is fixed from the bottom of the fork tube. I have pounded the stem onto the jam nut but any tightening pulls it out, instead of into the gooseneck. I need some kind of expanding jam nut. Any ideas? Otherwise I'll have to go back to the traditional stem with the top mounted quill bolt. I like the look but can't figure out how to mount it without a quill.
View attachment 96084

If I'm getting it right - you want to use a stem like this:

Those type of stems were used in all polish folding bicycles, and in some of the children bicycles. The head tube on the fork was longer, so that 1" of it was sticking above the top nut of the headset (the one that tightens the whole hedset. That nut was going all the way trough the thread on the fork tube). The top of the tube was cut in half and compressed by this clamp.

Maybe you can get a good look of how it was made in this picture:

If not, I can make some detailed pictures for you of one of my folding bikes.

 

[toro1978]

Well if the jam nut is on the bottom on the fork it is probably been driven in from the bottom, which means that it will expand if the tightening bolt is also on the bottom. Logically it will behave like this - when you tighten the boilt from the top the nut will just travel along the length of the shaft. Just hammer it out and reinsert it in the right direction.

 

[us56456712]

If I'm getting it right - you want to use a stem like this:

Those type of stems were used in all polish folding bicycles, and in some of the children bicycles. The head tube on the fork was longer, so that 1" of it was sticking above the top nut of the headset (the one that tightens the whole hedset. That nut was going all the way trough the thread on the fork tube). The top of the tube was cut in half and compressed by this clamp.

Maybe you can get a good look of how it was made in this picture:

If not, I can make some detailed pictures for you of one of my folding bikes.

Thanks, I didn't know it was from a folding bike but I am familiar with this system. Some track bicycles from the 1920s and some English bikes from that period had this type of fork clamp. My fork tube isn't long enough for a clamp like this. I made one.

 

[us56456712]

I tried putting an expander from a carbon fiber treadless headset inside the bottom of the stem but it could not expand the stem enough to keep the bars from twisting, despite a long slit cut in the bottom of the gooseneck. I had to weld a metric 5 bolt onto the end of a standard stem expander bolt and turn down the wedge on the expander so it would fit. It is wedged so tight in the stem that I can't get it out but it still did not exert enough pressure to keep it tight. I'll have to go back to a standard stem. If I had a long enough fork tube I might get it to work but I want to use the original fork.

 

[OddJob]

Were there any Finnish words flung about during the above ^ process?

 

[us56456712]

Were there any Finnish words flung about during the above ^ process?

Buskahozu