BIKES FROM POLAND

[GeePig]

I’ve never had undercoating done to a car, and I’ve heard both good and bad stories about what happens.

I think it all has to do with how clean the metal was when the coating was applied, however, It’s entirely likely that not everyone is using the same product. Maybe some of it was good and some of it was absolute garbage.

Many aeons ago, back when time was more youthful and I certainly was, the whole concept of undercoating with a brush and a tub of tarry undercoat was largely alien and, to be honest, with my decade or so old Minis, was never going to be a success. But I glooped it on, all over my welds, even though it was just going to rust through somewhere else. When I discovered it in aerosol form, I even sprayed it as racing stripes along the sides, just above the sills.

Anyway, more on undercoat as a layer of paint: https://www.inspirationspaint.com.au.

I love the barn find restoration. Especially the chopped fenders, black spokes and the satin black paint finish.
You can't miss with classic black and chrome. Love it.

Thank you

Actually the main sprocket, fenders and spokes are actually a dark green, but it is hard to see in that photo...

I have seen several bikes in the US badged as "TYLER" that were marked Made in Poland. I actually saw a Tyler frame in a salvage yard yesterday but didn't think to get a picture.

Yes, Romet has made a lot of non-Romet marked bikes over the years, and I while I have seen quite a few export bikes marked as "Universal", and even own one, I have never seen a Tyler outside of a few adverts.

It is my hope that one day one will come my way...

 

[GeePig]

Here is a few bits from some Romets, probably Wigrys.

There, on the trailer!

I think I have a pair of front wheels from some Wigrys on there, as well as a little bit of the frame. Looking at the rim design, I would say the bikes dated to somewhere between the late 1960s and about 1980. I have since rebuilt both wheels, although I have not refitted them yet as I tend to use my wheelbarrow instead.

Building these small hand pulled carts is common here, and they tend to use the common 20" and 24" wheels off bicycles as well as those off old motorcycles. Sometimes when you look around in the farm's barns you can find the rest of the bike.

I remember that the previous owners arrived at the farm just before we bought it, and got someone in to buy all the scrap metal that they could find in the barns. Maybe there were some bicycles, but I did not want to seem nosy, and what I saw was mostly bits of fencing and junk like that - but I was there to request whether I could keep this cart and also the blue Turing 2 bike, and they accepted. Since then I have found a few small bits, including a rear wheel of an old Ukraine bicycle.

Anyway, they only got about 1500 zloty for all that metal, and we would have paid them more than that for the property if they had pressed us...

 

[GeePig]

Wifie found this bike, and it is something that I have never seen before.

Well, the frame is clearly a Romet Jubilat design, but I am not sure of the origins of the Zefir name - it sounds classically Romet, similar to my Zenit version of the Jubilat.

So the frame is classic Jubilat, while the front fork looks like the alternative design that I have from my Danusia frame, and instead of having a wider spread rear frame for a '5 speed' derailleur that the Zenit classically had it is instead the normal Jubilat width. This frame has certainly been worked on as some of the joints have changed, the frame now folds to the left instead of the right, there is a larger tube between the frame hinge and the BB, there is a lug to mount the gear change cable and it still has a coaster brake like the classic Jubilat.

The wheels are certainly more modern, and I would not mind finding a pair like that.

Other than that the sprocket and BB, although if this bike is less than 4 years old I would like to know what kind of bearings it is using as the originals are no longer manufactured. I would say that this was probably the last of the Romets being manufactured, and once manufacturing of this and the fixed frame version had finished, the BB hub design finished as well.

I thought that the above was the only Zefir I had ever seen, but no, because I also had a photo of an older model, from probably around 2010, virtually the same as those built by Romet. The mudguards/fenders do not look like Romet ones, they are more similar to the bike above. Unlike the bike above, it has the classic coaster brake, standard steel wheels, original forks, series 2 frame stiffener and the frame folded to the right.

I have also seen other versions of the Jubilat for sale, this time marked 'Uniwersal' instead of the classic Romet 'Universal' spelling. I do not have any rights to any pictures of them, as I have only seen them advertised, dating to around 2012.

Funnily enough, they are easily recognisable as instead of using the classic Romet sprocket/BB design, they have one very similar to this one I fitted to my Zenit for the 2022 Spring build.

I will have to keep an eye open to getting a Zefir and a Universal as I want to make my Jubilat collection as diverse as possible

But then I also must get one of the non-folder versions of the Jubilat.

 

[GeePig]

These are the most common type of crank and sprocket you can find on a Romet, as they were fitted to the most popular bikes - the Wigry, Jubilat and Turing - as well as many others.

The crank on the right is worn out, and yet the one of the left is still in good condition - but they are both currently worthless as the right-hand inner bearing is worn out. They are a tight fit on the shaft, and they have been out of production for at least 4 years. Well, according to the main shop in Lublin, which we visited on Saturday, they have been out of production for 8 years, but I have seen pictures of bikes that are newer than that with these cranks fitted.

Now the bikes that have a BB and separate left and right hand cranks, such as my Zenit, I can just fit a later BB and all is well, but here I have to exchange everything. What is worrying is that the greasing of the BB in my most recent Romet was so bad that, even though it is low mileage, I could see significant bearing wear.

When I say everything, when we arrived at the bike shop that was once a classic Romet shop, just across from the castle, they were adamant that there was nothing that could replace the cranks - but I disagreed as they sold me a replacement BB and cranks just 2 years ago. That helped calm them down and, yes, they still had all those, so I bought one set for 244 zloty, and if I am happy with them then I will be back for another couple of sets. They said they did try buying a Chinese made BB kit, but the quality was really bad.

Now when I found my Amsterdam city bike, it actually had a very similar crank set, and some time over the next few months I am going to check whether I can fit that crank to a Romet. If it does, then I will see if I can track down replacement BB sets for that.

I am also going to keep the worn out crankset on the right until I get a welder, and then find out whether I can weld classic Romet cranks to later BB-crank sets. In the meantime I have a box full of old cranksets that just seems to keep getting heavier.

On other things, here is my main Kross. It usually sits in the background of some of my photos as it lives in the main barn and it is not something that I usually play around with. It is also only the second bike that I have bought from new.

Now the interesting thing here is the bridge, because although this is Poland, this bridge was made in Britain in about 1943, not far from where my Dad use to live. The purpose was to create a kind of bridge that would be easy and quick to assemble in any length for the military during the Second World War. Here it was built up from kit form to cross the main river in Lublin while they were renovating the railway bridge. It is still military green and still has the manufacturing dates still on it.

I love riding this bike, because I can ride it much further, especially as that means on and off road around where we live.

 

[GeePig]

This is the Flaming, another folder, and the only one that I remember seeing in reality.

Romet spent a lot of effort producing a range of step-thru designs in 20 and 24 inch designs, including the Jubilat (24"), Wigry (20") and the Flaming (20"), and all essentially using the same 24" or 20" wheels, mudguards, lighting, handlebars cranks etc.

And so this 20" wheel Flaming has essentially the same equipment as my 20" wheel Wigrys, other than the chainguard.

They went even further by producing non-folding frames very similar to the Jubilat, Wigry and Flaming, all with essentially the same running gear.

If I were not so interested in the non-Romet badged Romets, I would spend my time buying the cheapest Romets, stripping them down, and buying nice frames to build up into higher value bikes. If I came across a frame for one of these, or a run down bike, I could paint it and rebuild it from the spare parts stock I have, and sell it in the Spring for a decent profit.

This one has certainly been rebuilt, with new front light, seat, basket, reflectors and brake cables, and looks very nice.

I have since found the other picture I took of this bike:

Here you can see the three-speed hub more clearly, possibly a Sturmey-Archer, and the down-pull rear brake.

 

[GeePig]

This is a Romet Laura, but it is a bit of a puzzle.

Usually these were 5 speed derailleur machines, with some from the 1980s or maybe late 1970s have a 3 or maybe 5 speed hub - but this one appears to have a coaster brake. I cannot imagine why they would want to make this a coaster brake bike when the Turing was already that with a very similar frame.

The bike on the right is actually the only other Romet Zenit I have ever seen....

I took these pictures before I really began to take a serious interest in buying any other bikes, I just photographed them as two more old things that I could see around. Other than the different paint and labels, it is very similar to mine, except my one never had those high handlebars, but the downpull rear brake, the handlebar clamp, gear lever, main crank and derailleur, most of the kind of bits I would have expected in the Laura.

 

[sasza]

This is my favorite kids bike from my childhood Romet Reksio .
https://ratrodbikes.com/threads/reksio-v-1-0.113809/

 

[GeePig]

This is my favorite kids bike from my childhood Romet Reksio .
https://ratrodbikes.com/threads/reksio-v-1-0.113809/

I am thinking about getting a kids bike, most of the ones I see here are modern cheap ones from the Far East, but I would like some Romet as well. There is a very nice one, a Romet Bolek, for 320 zl on Allegro at the moment...

 

[sasza]

If it something like that , it is great.
http://mslonik.pl/images/stories/20110128_RoweryRomet/640_20120808_RometKatalog_2164_Jarek_zm.png

 

[Ulu]

Just because I looked it up, 320 zloty equals $60 US. Currently, 25 cents per zloty.

Here that would buy you a nice looking used import bike with flat tires and needing a serious lube job.

 

[GeePig]

This one has one of those special 'throttle boxes' that presumably make a noise when you rotate the right hand grip - I saw an identical one on someone's build here the other week.

Ah, if only I was a bike collector rather than an odd-model accumulator....

 

[GeePig]

We stayed for two weeks at somebodies summer house in a pine wood near a lake a few years back, where they even had a bike in the store room that I could take for long runs to the local villages and around the huge lake. The nearby town was also great to visit, and I was lucky enough to get this picture of two different but classic Romets, a Jubilat and and a Turing 2. These old bikes are quickly disappearing now, but when I arrived in Poland some 25 years ago getting a replacement bike was difficult and they were rarely seen other than out in the country. Today, with more modern bikes being available and ridden, now highly popular even in the cities, it was like a last opportunity to get this pair.

My Jubilat that is actually marked as a Jubilat is very similar to this one, with the badges worn away in similar places, and if it were not for the replacement saddle that this one has and the mettalic paint mine has, it is close enough to where I bough mine that it could have been the same bike.

I have also found this picture of my Kross Best Junior, which was very worn out and quickly stripped down for parts that I could use on my Romets. It was only a couple of years later that I realised that this was a direct copy of the Romet Samanta, a design that Kross had either purchased completely or the just the right to build it. Over the years they have made gradual but massive changes to the design, such that unless you knew the bikes history over the past 25 years or so you would never recognise it today.

When you look at my other picture of just the frame it looks quite different, but that is just because of the angle. This is one of the reasons that I like to photograph all my bikes standing upright either here in the garages in Lublin or against the side of my barns in the country.

If you look carefully you will see that it has a red plastic chain guard on the rear wheel, which is marked 'ROMET'. I just assumed that someone must have fitted it, since they had replaced the front aluminium wheel with a steel one, also probably from a Romet.

 

[GeePig]

Here is my Kross again, outside a vehicle scrapyard, the kind of place where I spent a lot of my time when I was much, much, much more youthful.

I have done very little to my Kross since I bought it - it has a front mudguard added, but the mount for the rear one kept getting slack so that it would drop and touch the rear wheel, so I removed it, it has the pouch for a few tools and my camera, a water bottle and bracket and the lamps. I give it a clean and a service sometimes, and I need to rebuild the pedal bearings sometime, and it has been ridden much further than any of my other bikes.

The green van? Oh, that is a Żuk, made here in Lublin between 1958 and 1998. This and the Nysa van had about a 95% share of the van market here in Poland, but they are rarely seen today. I remember when I saw them often every day, then about once a day, once a week, once a month and now it is like once a year.

The sign on the wall says 'AUTO CZĘŚCI' (car parts), 'PONIEDZIAŁEK-PIĄTEK' (monday-friday) and 'SOBOTA' (saturday).

I do have a grille and an unbroken 'ZUK' badge...

 

[68z27]

These are the most common type of crank and sprocket you can find on a Romet, as they were fitted to the most popular bikes - the Wigry, Jubilat and Turing - as well as many others.

The crank on the right is worn out, and yet the one of the left is still in good condition - but they are both currently worthless as the right-hand inner bearing is worn out. They are a tight fit on the shaft, and they have been out of production for at least 4 years. Well, according to the main shop in Lublin, which we visited on Saturday, they have been out of production for 8 years, but I have seen pictures of bikes that are newer than that with these cranks fitted.

Now the bikes that have a BB and separate left and right hand cranks, such as my Zenit, I can just fit a later BB and all is well, but here I have to exchange everything. What is worrying is that the greasing of the BB in my most recent Romet was so bad that, even though it is low mileage, I could see significant bearing wear.

When I say everything, when we arrived at the bike shop that was once a classic Romet shop, just across from the castle, they were adamant that there was nothing that could replace the cranks - but I disagreed as they sold me a replacement BB and cranks just 2 years ago. That helped calm them down and, yes, they still had all those, so I bought one set for 244 zloty, and if I am happy with them then I will be back for another couple of sets. They said they did try buying a Chinese made BB kit, but the quality was really bad.

Now when I found my Amsterdam city bike, it actually had a very similar crank set, and some time over the next few months I am going to check whether I can fit that crank to a Romet. If it does, then I will see if I can track down replacement BB sets for that.

I am also going to keep the worn out crankset on the right until I get a welder, and then find out whether I can weld classic Romet cranks to later BB-crank sets. In the meantime I have a box full of old cranksets that just seems to keep getting heavier.

On other things, here is my main Kross. It usually sits in the background of some of my photos as it lives in the main barn and it is not something that I usually play around with. It is also only the second bike that I have bought from new.

Now the interesting thing here is the bridge, because although this is Poland, this bridge was made in Britain in about 1943, not far from where my Dad use to live. The purpose was to create a kind of bridge that would be easy and quick to assemble in any length for the military during the Second World War. Here it was built up from kit form to cross the main river in Lublin while they were renovating the railway bridge. It is still military green and still has the manufacturing dates still on it.

I love riding this bike, because I can ride it much further, especially as that means on and off road around where we live.

I was looking for some engine parts the other night and came across some engine valve grinding compound and I remembered your situation regarding worn out bearing races. Since you have several you are not using you may want to try to hand lap (or motorize with a drill) the circular motion of the spindle, race, round bearings, and lapping compound. Start with a coarse grit (120 if you have it) and finish with a fine 220 grit. After some smoothing of the race/bearing surface, you may need to step up in ball size (metric or SAE). I am going to try this technique this weekend to see how well (or poorly) it works. If it does we can ask to have it moved to the tips n trix thread.......

 

[GeePig]

I was looking for some engine parts the other night and came across some engine valve grinding compound and I remembered your situation regarding worn out bearing races. Since you have several you are not using you may want to try to hand lap (or motorize with a drill) the circular motion of the spindle, race, round bearings, and lapping compound. Start with a coarse grit (120 if you have it) and finish with a fine 220 grit. After some smoothing of the race/bearing surface, you may need to step up in ball size (metric or SAE). I am going to try this technique this weekend to see how well (or poorly) it works. If it does we can ask to have it moved to the tips n trix thread.......

That is a good idea, I have not used valve grinding compound in 30 years.

The problem I have with mine is that they get badly damaged, like really dented and even cracked, but there must be a lot of worn bearings out there and I am sure that I will find some with repairable damage.

 

[68z27]

That is a good idea, I have not used valve grinding compound in 30 years.

The problem I have with mine is that they get badly damaged, like really dented and even cracked, but there must be a lot of worn bearings out there and I am sure that I will find some with repairable damage.

@GeePig
I'm not sure if it's a good idea (above). Here is what I tried and it may offer some help for non-replaceable or non-available brgs/races. I did all of this with a hand drill and did not try doing it by hand (see below) which may be a better option. I had 2 grits: coarse 120 and (I recommend) fine 220.

1. coarse may be too coarse as it left behind a rough surface
2. fine may be a little coarse too. There were no high or low spots on the race as it evened out all of the surfaces but still left a slightly rough surface texture....I did not try polishing it afterwards.
3. I used a hand drill. It worked VERY fast. I didn't try this by hand but that may be the better process.
4. What ever bearings you use, you may want to consider them junk after doing this. The brgs on the left are bright and shiny and the one on the right are dull with a surface texture. Also, you may not be able to rinse out the grinding compound completely and I am sure the grinding compound will not "play nicely" with the bearing grease.
5. If doing this, you may want to practice on some junk parts first.
Just some thoughts.....md

 

[GeePig]

I was thinking of using a small drill press, when I can find one, but I really would like to find someone with a lathe. With that there is a chance of removing the tempering, making a tool with the right profile to lightly cut it, grinding it similar to how you have done it here, and then retempering it.

I could do it, I just need the tools.

 

[GeePig]

I have been working on my purple Wigry, in an attempt to exchange the crank and BB with one off a Dutch bike, an Amsterdam. Now both the Amsterdam and my purple Wigry were put out as rubbish here at my block at the same time, so I took them both in. The Wigry was in pieces and was lacking the left hand crank, so I removed the crank from the Amsterdam and fitted it to the Wigry, along from a pair of pedals that I can no longer remember where I got them from. Now that I have had a while to think about it, I need to compare this crank with my other Romet cranks as the Amsterdam had been partially rebuilt after an accident.

These Romet BB dust covers are not as good as they might look, as there is no way of actually blocking grit from getting around them and into the bearings over time.

You can also see that the welding on the frame varies between very good and not very good.

This Wigry is not a high mileage bike by any means, but you can see the amount of dirt inside the dust covers, and I have either got to clean the bearings or replace them.

This is the inner bearing on the non-crank side - it is gritty and there is damage to the bearing surface. When I saw this I was worried about the condition of the other bearing.

This is the Amsterdam I will be using the bearings and crank to replace the Wigry's. The types of bearing are very similar, and the crank does resemble some of them used on Romet bikes, although not the Wigry as far as I know. Many other parts of this bike, like the saddle and handlebars, are also mounted on my Romet Turing 2, also in my garage and also ready for a BB bearing and crank change.

This is the crank off the Amsterdam bike, and if it were not for the risk of damaging the crank-side inner bearing while removing it, I would see if it would fit the Romet crank. If the Amsterdam BBs do fit, and if they were still available, then it would have solved a whole problem for the Romet crank.

Here is the Amsterdam crank and a Romet crank. They have some differences, enough that were these Amsterdam cranks still available then I would be considering measuring them, and then checking to see how much the BB kit cost. I do have a few cranks off cheap bikes that, once you remove the plastic on the cranks and clean them up, could have the sprocket cut off and replaced by one from a Romet.

I would say that I worry more about cranks than I do about any other part of my Romets, as most other parts are available and ready for cleaning up or replacing.

 

[68z27]

Keep the faith, @GeePig . I think you are doing a good job and are on track finding a solution. When it comes to re-tempering brg races, you put me in an area I have not tried before, however, I have a buddy who has done some heat treating and may be able to offer some advice. I wish I had one of these brgs in hand to get a better view of what you are up against.
Question: are the ball brgs 5/16" (approx 7.86mm) or are they closer to a true 8mm (or other) diameter?.........
Also, I will post some of my weekend results later today or tomorrow........

 

[GeePig]

Well it is many, many years since I have done anything like that, but it is something I look forward to trying out again, especially with my limited resources.
Most of my things are at my village 'farm', but I have always assumed that the bearings are still 5/16" even if most of everything else is metric on a bike. I am interested in checking, so I might put some balls in my bag and try measuring them the next time I am somewhere with some measuring kit.