Can you ID these two bikes???

[GodHatesCleveland]

A buddy of mine lives in Kansas. He just restored a 1967 John Deer tractor to showroom condition which he plans on actually using at his farm. Now he wants to restore two old bikes he has in his barn as close to original as he can get them, so finding out the exact year and model would be a big help. He did a beautiful job on the tractor:

One bike is a JC Higgins that his brother repainted and tried to turn into a BMX bike back in the seventies. It has a regular flat sided tank and fenders with a delta light (not pictured). Couldn't find the chain guard. The serial number was under the bottom bracket and reads 49422. That's probably not the original handlebars, the apes were most likely added by the older brother.

The other bike is a Hawthorne board tracker style. The serial number was also under the bottom bracket and was ?9 6005 (I couldn't read the first digit because paint had settled over part of it, but there was definitely a space between the first two digits and the last four). The front fork looked like it was taken from a different bike. The pedals and crank were definitely taken off another bike, but the chain ring looked legit. No chain guard. Lucky 7 seat post. A Troxel seat was under the seat cover.

Both bikes had skip tooth chains if that makes any difference.

 

[Jay Moore]

you can buy a book at classicbicyclenews.com they have a book with all the info for those bikes. the hawthorne looks like a mid to late 40's hawthorne victory bike. here are some facts that might help as well. For 1941 Hawthorne changed suppliers to Rollfast from Cleveland Welding. The Standard "Equipped" and "Tank" models had the Rollfast spring fork with a single vertical spring mounted in front of the head tube. This allowed the travel of the front wheels to be more vertical. The ladies bikes featured pressed steel skirt guards. These bikes still used rear kickstands, standard carriers, optional 2 speed (still lever actuated), fork mounted Delta light and painted rims. The "All American" had all these features plus chrome ; rims chain guard and rims, white wall tires, side stand and Torrington signal pedals. The Comet did not have the chrome chain guard, Signal pedals, thick saddle but otherwise appears similar to the more deluxe "All American". The Litwate line carries on. 1942 found the "Victory Bikes" that were stripped of all unneeded options to minimize the use of war materials. The "V-50" was the unequipped bike while the "V-60" added a chain guard, self contained light, ladies skirtguard to the "V-50" along with the option of the 2 speed. There were no rear carriers on these models but they do use side stands. The "V-70" was the equipped model with the spring fork, self contained headlight, new larger chain guard and "Blue flash Safety-Light" in the carrier. It had a red tail light with a blue center light that was activated by the brake. These bikes had black wall tires, no carriers or tanks to save on materials. For the war years 1943-1945 only replacement parts were available. 1946 and 1947 found just basic men's and ladies models. They had small chain guards, torpedo headlights without tanks or carriers. For 1948 all full line of bikes were available again. The base truss rods models without carriers or headlights and a second model with carrier and new fender light that was a more square headlight with a square lens. The Special tank model used the self contained fork mounted headlight, rounded tank , spring fork, chrome rims and white wall tires. The Deluxe Tank bike featured a new tank with "gills" at the front and a new carrier with a raised center "rib" down the middle and had the "Blue Flash Safety-Light" in the rear. The 1949 models appear to be carry over from the 1948 bikes. 1950 marks the appearance of a new head badge. It is more of a "crest" with the M/W letters. The top model has a new turn signal carrier with a handlebar mounted control. A standard tank model is added for a lower priced tank model. The top 1951 model gets seat crash rails, new paint scheme with "twisted pinstripes" on the tank and chainguard. The truss rods bow out to clear the headlight and there is a new rounded front chain guard. The spring fork and turn signal carrier are still used. The regular tank bike has the standard carrier and chain guard, smooth sided tank, bowed truss rods (to clear the unique sealed beam light) and black wall tires. The 1952 bikes look the same except that the turn signal control is moved form the handlebar to the top tube.

 

[Uncle Stretch]

Its weird that it looks like it has a spacer under the neck on the second one. The frame looks just like the elgin motorbike I'm building . Has the same short neck. Bet the forks are off of something else.

 

[olschbp]

The hawthorne is more than likely a '35 motorbike as it has the pinch together seat clamp, in 36 they went to a differant headbadge, andseat clamp, as I have one, looks like someone removed the rear fender spacers, the frame and the fork, is probly of a girls bike, but correct stye for bike,wheels look original to me,

 

[37fleetwood]

Hi, your best bet is to join over at the Cabe http://www.thecabe.com there are a few guys there who are experts on this stuff. the first bike is a 1950's Murray made J.C.Higgins sold through Sears. the next one is a mid 1930's Montgomery Wards Hawthorne. though not an expert I am guessing Cleveland Welding built though could be built by Snyder for Wards. that frame style was popular from the '20's through the later '30's. balloon tires were introduced in about 1935 and that frame style was phased out in about 1937 so yours is most likely 1935-7. very cool bike, I had one, mine had metal clad 26" wooden wheels. if in good shape the wheels are pretty valuable though I would not sell parts off of it. if you want to sell, put it on the Cabe. the guys over there are more into old originals and will pay more for it as it is. the '50's Higgins is pretty unremarkable and not too valuable. hope this helps.
Scott 8)

 

[GodHatesCleveland]

Thanks everybody for your help. I spoke to my buddy today and after I mentioned that the front fork didn't look original it jogged his memory a bit and he recalled something about his grandfather telling him about bending the front fork and replacing it. I'll tell him it's suspected to be an old motorbike frame and see what happens.

The rims were interesting. Not only was it a raised center rim, but it was a double raised rim. I've never seen a double raised center rim before and forgot about it until now. Guess my memory needs a little jolt every now and then too.....

Thanks again everybody. The willingness and friendliness everyone has to share their knowledge never fails to impress me. Happy New Year!

 

[Rustinkerer]

I agree with oldsch, I just checked the book, 35 was the last year for that style badge. Also, 1955 was the last year for skiptooth JC Higgins. ~Adam

 

[dos cruiser]

Heres a pic of an Elgin on Dave's Vintage Bikes

http://www.nostalgic.net/arc/bicycles/1923%20Elgin/

This is a moto bike that will give your friend a good start on what to look for in his bike.

 

[37fleetwood]

HI, the Elgin posted is over a decade earlier and the accessories and such would be quite different. in the '30's everything was heading toward streamlining. I have some catalogs and stuff if your buddy is going to keep the bike but the best thing would be to see if you could find the Hawthorne/Elgin/Higgins book, it will be very helpful in figuring out everything.
Scott 8)