Did I dodge a bullet or am I out of line?

[The Black Monark]

Contacted a seller about a crankset and fork, here's how it went, abridged for brevity and to protect identity:

TBM: "Hello, I'm interested in the parts noted below please, and others too if you can send pics of things not yet posted."
Seller: "Both Hawthorne stuff ... forks are off of an early 30's 26" that had rain gutter fenders and the crank was off of a late 30's ....pedal hole center to crank shaft center is 6-3/4" long ...."
TBM: "Thanks, are the cups included with the crank?"
Seller: "I will include a set , yes"
TBM: "Not the orig tho?"
Seller: "Yes , I have the original to go with it .... Just took it apart last week ...."
TBM: "..and what is the condition of the cones, please?"
Seller: "They Should clean up just fine . Bike was intact and original ..."
TBM: "Thanks, I'm concerned about pitting to the cones and races."
Seller: ".... The parts should be just fine ...."
TBM: "understand that they should be fine, but from my experience it is better for both of us to determine that before payment and shipment. I'd be buying these to use, so worn out or damaged parts aren't any good to me. Would you send pictures of the parts, please?"
Seller: "Well .... I built $10,000 dollar Cummins & Caterpillar motors so if I say they should clean up just fine , they will , I don't want them back so , I do not wish to sell anything to you because I can see what's transpiring , thanks ...."
TBM: "Okay, thank you for your time."

Thoughts?

 

[user 135]

I generally don't air my laundry in the open.*
It depends, if the advertisement was for a complete crankset w/BB or just the crank. To me the crank would be more important than the BB unless you were buying the crank to get the BB.

*Easiest reference and not mend to offend.

 

[chepe13]

Am I tbe only me ever here who rides with all the old gear, even if it's pitted? Lol, I ride my bikes A LOT, have used some cones and races with pitting, but after cleaning and lubing, they've worked just fine.


I don't think you were too pushy, or crossed any lines, but perhaps you could have asked for better detailed shots of the components, seems like that would have been easier.

 

[Bicycle808]

I don't think you crossed a line at all. I can see how, playing devil's advocate, you might have seemed pretty picky about some small wear-n-tear parts that are over 80 years old, BUT I think it may've been best to address this with a picture and a candid but optimistic opinion, eg: "The cones look pretty good to me, considering the age of the pieces. Here are some pics that show the worst of the pitting (*insert close-up, detailed pics here*)" This should inform the customer, and protect the seller if you did complain about the condition, as in "I sent you some detailed pics before you pulled the trigger."

Still, in this day'n'age, I can understand how a seller might be reluctant to sell to any uber-discerning customers. Too many ppl make a big deal out of things, and it's not worth the hassle on low-buck items. Still, I like this site b/c ppl tend to be pretty laid back about sales and all. I hope it will stay that way.

 

[Rat Rod]

Ask for photos...problem solved.

 

[A.S.BOLTNUT]

Pictures can save a thousand words .




~RafaeL~

 

[The Black Monark]

Yup, asked for pics, then was told to kick rocks. Way she goes I guess

 

[kingfish254]

I don't think you crossed the line.

As a devil's advocate, If it was a bargain basement item, I can see where some sellers might not want to put the extra effort into doing their due diligence on the condition of an item. Sounds more like he was thinking that you were challenging his evaluation of the condition.

 

[g-ratter]

With our modern day communication methods people can easily miss read the tone of an email/tex. Seems to be what he did.

 

[mikeeebikey]

That guy was a feminine cleaning product.

 

[5speed]

as MacBeth once said"he protests to loudly" AJ

 

[oldfart36]

Sounds like 2 guys trying to come to terms, then he copped an attitude! Each to his own. Your good, you'll most likely find better!

 

[ozzmonaut]

I can understand both sides of this. If I get picky about a part, I'd like to see pics or be fully assured that the part is as described. However, whenever I have sold an item (granted I try to post detailed pics ahead of time), if I receive questions from a potential buyer who seems very worried about internal components and such, I also quietly hope that they will not pull the trigger. It isn't that I have anything to hide, but I'd rather not have to worry that someone is unhappy with their purchase. You also have the people who will buy something (mostly an ebay issue), and then use some minute flaw to complain to paypal and get a partial refund without having to return the actual item. In the earlier stages of ebay, a guy purchased a hotwheels item from me, and after purchasing requested that I send him extra accessories that I didn't even have. When I did not he spent the next month threatening me with negative feedback and other assorted threats. Similarly, a lady who wanted to buy a bike on CL asked that I do some work on it which she would pay for. She changed her mind about the work and when I did not agree to undo said work and sell to her at the original price she spent days threatening me with police, lawyers, verbal contract suits, etc. These days I am more afraid of buyers than I ever have been of sellers. Bottom line, if you are selling be ready to defend yourself. If you are buying, look for items that already are adequately represented . No bike or part is worth more blood,sweat, and tears than you will already pour working on it

 

[mikeeebikey]

My thoughts, besides my previous post, are real simple.
Prove you are selling your product at a good price not because it is garbage.
Been burned way to many times to trust words or a hand shake.
My dealings in court have caused me not to call on them.
I have been taken to court because the wife sold me a car to cheap. The husband decided he wanted another $500.00, I felt like I was going to be ordered to pay it because I scrapped the car. The pictures they showed the judge were not the car I crushed.
Now a days I don't do sales, I sell little, and do repairs...which opens a whole can of worms!
But, I do document any repairs denied by the customer, and am more than willing to prove a used part is a good one.

 

[Gold Street Customs]

I think you were in the right, you might have caught the guy on a bad day, happens....

 

[GuitarlCarl]

Hmm. I see the sellers dilemma. He was selling forks and a crankset. You asked about the cups, sounds like multiple times, about originality, pitting and such. IF he was really only concerned with selling the crankset, repeated questions about the cups he was going to throw in, can come off as nitpicking over a freebie.

But I wasn't there, and didn't see the original conversation. I am just stating an observation. I also agree wholeheartedly with the second post about dirty laundry...

Carl.

 

[Bicycle808]

That makes sense, Carl, but the seller could just be like "the cups aren't original, and a little pitted, but they come free with the purchase". Or, even, "the cups are original, and awesome, and free." Even if he was annoyed, he could've answered the question straight, right? "Should be fine" means a lot of different things to different ppl.

 

[GuitarlCarl]

True, and we could what if this all day... what if the buyer had accepted the fact that the seller was selling a crank, and that the cups were just used cups? We wouldn't be debating the what ifs... Anyone expecting NOS from a part out is asking for a lot don't you think? What happens when we don't get the answers we want? Here, buy the crank and I'll include some cups that should clean up. Doesn't sound like a jerk to me. Sounds like a guy trying to sell a crank without a hassle, and ended up hanging on a laundry line...

Carl.

 

[gato'sbikes]

+1 carl

 

[Bicycle808]

Asking for a lot is one thing... and, yeah, expecting pristine BB parts for this very old crank might be a lot. Expecting a straight, thorough, honest answer, on the other hand, seems perfectly reasonable. And that's all the Monark seems to have been complaining about with this post.