First (Documented) Build 20, 20" Torker Vagabond 24" conversion

[2Can86]

Gday all, new hacker to the forum, you can read my intro here

http://ratrodbikes.com/forum/index.php?threads/long-time-lurker-first-time-poster.85179/

Anyways thought id post up some pics of a build im soon to be starting.

I picked up this mid 90's torker vagabond frame, it originally appealed to me becasue of its old school "muscle bike" styling.

The main concept is a rusty rat with 24" wheels and an aggressive mtb tread, sort of a rusty mud basher.
Hugely unconventional but it's whats in my brain box so thats where im heading lol.

Im in two minds on which direction to take, im torn between keeping the frame unmodified and going a purely bolt on setup with rear dropout extensions. My conflict with this as the frames rather small and a bmx the rake is not really gonna suit so im most likely gonna have to go a modified girvin style setup or i also had in mind a two-stage head tube setup where i'll fabricate a bracket with a built in head tube that bolts to the original head tube therefore relocating where the head tube actually rides.

My other option which will be easier is to go full chop on the frame, you can see in my "highly detailed" haha, pic below. I'll remove the seatpost (red) and relocate it further back on a steeper angle, il cut through the two top tubes where it conects to the head tube (purple) and then cut a wedge at the rear dropout and the downtube where it connects to the BB (blue). The toptube and downtube will both then be lifted/bent up til the gaps closed and i will reweld at the desired rake, i will most likely have to extend the head tube if i take this path.

Anyways hope to get stuck into this one soon, im more than happy to hear peoples input and opinions on this one, im sure im not the first to try so if anyone foresees issues in my design than let me have it!

 

[LukeTheJoker]

That is a cool frame, not sure if I have seen one before! If it is not an important/collectable frame I will almost always vote for a chop and re-weld, but that is just me...

Luke.

 

[2Can86]

Some people consider them collectable, along with the higher end "kickback" model, but theyre pretty common! Give em 10yrs and they will be highly desireable i rekon but for now tis no biggie to violate the frame haha!

 

[tonygameboy]

I've got a similar 24" cruiser frame but nothing of value. I'm going to be watching this build!


I LIKE BIKES

 

[2Can86]

Is your 24" also a torker or more so just an modern old school look cruiser? Id be keen to see it.

Anyways made some progress today,

Time to chop!!!


The first wedges cut, i ended up taking too much out so there was quite the gap to fill, and with an arc and low-hydrogen electrodes it wasnt the easiest so im gonna redo it with the mig at work


Heres as she sits at the moment, pretty happy with the rake now, im still gonna go with the dropout extension off the rear as i plan on running 24"s, headstem to be extended and top-tubes to be cut back.

 

[2Can86]

Forgot to add, no more seat tube!!!!

 

[whitefiretiger]

Looking good.
Myself I'd be thinking about extending the bottom tube rather than cutting the top tubes.

 

[2Can86]

I also thought about that, but seeing as the bottom tube is curved and slightly oval itd be rather difficult to do without it being noticeable.

Im hoping that with rear dropout extensions and laying the seat tube back further the shortness of the bottom tube won't be an issue.

But trial and error will soon tell me which way to go!

 

[whitefiretiger]

Another thought is to cut the chain stays and extend them until the top tubes are aligned up where the new longer head tube will be. This would also eliminate the need for dropout extensions. If nothing else just extend them the needed (2") length for the 24" wheel to fit this 20" wheel frame then trim the top tubes as needed. Then after all weled up it would be easy to move the brace that will most likely interfere with the new bigger wheel/ tire that's between the top tubes and re-locate it.

I'm thinking this would be a better option for you.
Here's a quick Photoshop of your frame with the chainstay extended idea.

 

[2Can86]

I never thought of extending the chain stays, great idea, will definately consider that.

If only id thought of that before i cut the top tubes, if id dont that first i couldve just cut through the middle of the headtube and just added a spacer in.

I dont plan on painting this one, i plan on goin full rat and full rust!

 

[LukeTheJoker]

Beautiful start, that idea of WFT's is a good one!
Keep at it, following along!

Luke.

 

[whitefiretiger]

Hopefully my idea helps.
Man I wish I had a welder again; I'd probably lose my job tho from forgetting to go to work while playing with bikes lol.

 

[junknutz1975]

Welcome!
Great build so far !

 

[2Can86]

Hopefully my idea helps.
Man I wish I had a welder again; I'd probably lose my job tho from forgetting to go to work while playing with bikes lol.

Haha, i dont use mine enough! Guess when welding is your job its not quite the same novelty, but i do love welding! I have a cigweld transmig which is basically a rebadged thermal arc fabricator, mig, tig and arc all in one. In my eyes for what you get there pretty reasonably priced and if you look after em they should last a long time.

Having the arc also helps if you ever run out of gas.

 

[whitefiretiger]

I turn into a kid when I have an arc welder. Tend to enjoy blowing holes threw thick metal with them.
Idk why I do but for some reason I enjoy it.

Heck I miss having a no gas needed 110v wire welder; it at least let me tack stuff together to have fully welded later.

 

[2Can86]

Haha im with you on that one, we had 300 amp machines at tradeschool and we use to have a blast cranking them right up with 3.2mm electrodes.

Quite easy and enjoyable when your not paying for materials and consumables!

Alot of people dont give gasless migs the time of day, i find more often than not there the ones who dont have the right technique or there trying to push them past there capabilites.

For thin walled tubing on bikes and stuff there more than capable

 

[whitefiretiger]

Nothing like blasting a hole threw 1/2" + thick plate lol.

I tried welding some tubing with the one I had (without gas but using "non gas wire); got a decent looking bead but couldn't get enough penetration and it came apart. That's when I took to using it to tack stuff into place then having a friend going to welding school to fully weld it.
My welder died tho and repair was going to be what the thing was new.
Maybe I'll get a new one some day (like when I have a garage of my own again)

 

[2Can86]

Ok little progree today.

Got the rear chainstay extensions made up, was limited to 40mm otherwise the top tubes would've ran to far back from the head tube! If worst comes to worst and 40mm isnt enough i may just do the same to the top tubes aswell to make it fit. I actually had to make the internal sleeve a bit longer as there wast enough meat there to have any real effect, but the picture gives you an idea

 

[2Can86]

Also word of advice, when trying a new process practice on something unimportant first lol which is pretty obvious to most!

I did all the current welding on the frame using mig silicon bronze as i only had pure argon which is no good for standad mig mild steel, it looks semi ok but it required alot of buffing and grinding which has left some parts of the frame relatively thin! Good thing this one wont be doin any stunts haha.

 

[whitefiretiger]

Did that give enough to get a 24" wheel in there?
If not redo the extensions till it does then like you said you could do the same to the top tubes to get everything to work out.