looking into getting a welder? need help

[iven]

ok so im have never welded or anything before, i want something that will work alright and everything, so i can make some parts maybe a frame even if i get good enough with it..

im not sure if its like a flux, wire feed or mig or what?
not very good info on the model or anything..

http://yubasutter.craigslist.org/tls/3386462817.html

is this a good deal?

 

[Onewheelsqueel]

If it works its not a bad price. I'd prefer a higher amperage for better penetration though, 130 or 140 amps. Its a mig welder, with either gas or no gas option. You need to get the intructions for it! Look for them on line if they don't have em. You need to know which way to wire the gun for gas or non gas.

Preferably you want to use gas for easier, cleaner, better welding.

 

[yoothgeye]

The only reason I went with a name brand (Lincoln) over a non-name brand was because of the availability of replacement parts (haven't needed any).

Of course, I don't know much about welders still, so this could be a known name brand and I could look like an ......

For $100 I'd buy it to get into welding if I was still shopping.

 

[iven]

this could be even better but where ima get money for it :/
http://sacramento.craigslist.org/tls/3396363072.html

 

[outskirtscustoms]

Word of advice, I don't know about the tig welder but I had a Harbor Freight wire feed mig and it was JUNK! I literally used it twice before the wire feed system stripped out and I had to take it back and exchange it. I'm currently saving up to get a good welder like a Lincoln, Miller, or Hobart.

 

[iven]

Word of advice, I don't know about the tig welder but I had a Harbor Freight wire feed mig and it was JUNK! I literally used it twice before the wire feed system stripped out and I had to take it back and exchange it. I'm currently saving up to get a good welder like a Lincoln, Miller, or Hobart.

probably best i save some money later, and when i got my own place.. guess ill just see if a machine shop can help me with my builds till i can afford a welder.. :/

 

[Jawon]

I'm only on my 2nd bike welding project, so my opinion is as good as my welds! But... as a newbie, I settled on the Harbor Freight 80amp Inverter Arc Welder http://www.harborfreight.com/catalog/pr ... egory/434/ (HF haters, please don't pound on me).

Main reasons were because I wanted simplicity (just plug it into any household outlet and start burning) and I don't intend to weld anything thicker than bike tubes. Plus this welder is small and I do take it around.

I know a stick welder won't ever make perfectly beautiful welds, but it works for ratrodding and I'm having a blast with it. Of course I can't speak to the longevity of this particular model, but I'm staying hopeful based on the great reviews on the website. Good luck!

 

[yoothgeye]

I gave $180 for my used Lincoln, it had only had 1 roll of wire fed through it, that was over 4 years ago and probably 10 rolls of wire I've used.

I think spending a couple hundred on a decent used unit to get you started will save you money from having a project shop do it and teach you along the way. If you hate it, you can sell it too, welders sell pretty easily from what I've seen.

 

[outskirtscustoms]

If you live fairly close to HF the Harbor freight welder will work (hopefully :roll: ) Just make sure to get the extended warranty. That will buy you two years of guaranteed welding plus however long the welder lasts. (Exchange it on the last day of warranty just to be safe... :lol: ) In the mean time save your money and when the warranty runs out you'll probably have enough to get a nice used name brand welder. :wink: I may have gotten one that was returned on my first time round, the second worked till I traded it off about a month later but I didn't use it much.

Normally a shop around here charges $50 an hour with a one hour minimum (and they take their sweet time) so your first project might cost as much as getting your own welder.

 

[yoothgeye]

Those Century welders are bullet proof! Everyone brags about their Lincolns and Millers, and for good reasons. However, I have had a 110v Century like for 15 years or more that that I initially bought to carry out in the field due to its size and portability. Since then I have literally run hundreds of spools of wire and tanks of gas through it and it has never needed anything but consumables and replacement liners for the gun. It welds great with flux core, too, if you don't have a gas bottle! Buy it at that price!
One word of advice though: It HAS to have a minimum of 115V and 20 amps to run! If your garage circuit runs lower voltage like 110-113volts and is on a 15 amp breaker, you will be tripping the breaker constantly! And never run it on a light extension cord...

I'll take a good review over 2 bad ones, I say buy it now.

 

[outskirtscustoms]

If you have to go to a shop, get the names of some of the welders, then contact them away from the shop. Many of those guys will have equipment at home and will do the job for you cheaper.

Also, many high school trade schools have community education programs where you can go learn to weld. Usually, the price is pretty reasonable. You can take your stuff in and weld it in class and learn at the same time. There you can also sometimes obtain good contacts for welders who have equipment at home also.

Also if you were a welding student I know a few welder brands give STUDENT DISCOUNTS!!! :mrgreen:

 

[Wingman]

I have talked about this several times lol.

I bet in the last 10 years, I have had the oppertunity to pick up a decent TIG werlder, compleate with torch handle ,bottle & regulator at least 10 times I can remember.
Most of the older machines are a little larger & have Copper windings on the machines. I will call these machines pre 90's machines.
Lincoln, Lindy, Miller & Hobart all made decent Machines.
The older stuff may not have all the bells & whistles that the Modern ones have BUT.... should work well for what you guys are doing.
Always remember .... its a combo of things that make a good welder.
talent + reasonable equiptment= reasonable degree of success/ Nice welds.

Yea yea yea, anyone can weld .... Grandmaw can wirefeed , it would stick & it would look like Bird Do Do but it would indeed be a weld.
on the other hand, give the same welder to grandpaw , it would look like a nice weld , folks wouldn't snicker about it, instead mayby admire it and again it is just a weld .

So in the end , I guess ya have to ask your self...... " What do you want out of life. " and are you willing to settle on COMPLACENTCY ( i proably spelled that wrong lol... Im a welder not a speller ).

Folks are gonna see your stuff .... do you care that they might snicker about it ?? If not, go for it & make all the mess ya can stand yano. It's yours , who cares .

Back to buying a decent machine .... 500.00 to 1000.00 should get all the TIG welder you guys should need for a lifetime.
When you have the skills & the rite equiptment, it shouldn't take very long to pay for your new toy doing small side jobs. In the big picture , spending 1000.00 on a tool like this is a lifetime investment. How many years of your life do ya wana give away struggling with sub par equiptmnt ?? How much stuff do you wanna make a mess out of ?

My creedo about these things is "Anything worth doing is worth doing rite"

I have witnessed the " Never enough time time to do it rite the first time but alwayws time to do it rite a second time" or the " Do you want it done rite or do you want it done rite now lol kinda of mentality".
Buying LOW QUALITY, Cheep stuff is a certain reciept for a poor quality job or failures.

When your on a budget, you will have to DISAPLINE your self to think this way & mayby try to save for a year for this kinda purchase . This may sound tough, BUT IN the long run you will be better of for it & much HAPPYIER for doing it this way. Take that time to take some classes at your local Junior Collage or ROP, night school ect.
I hate cheeters ..... why cheet your self.

lol ... ok , now go buy that cheep welder ... sermon over ... some things you just have to learn for your self ... this is proably one of them.
Not BAGGING on ya ok ..... just wish there was a simple way to make everyone understand
Stephen

 

[outskirtscustoms]

Good advice wingman.

 

[DougC]

I would agree that a lot of the cheaper electric welders don't really work that great. Especially on thinner metal like bicycle frame tubes. Go look on welding forums and there is always lots of people asking why their welds aren't working right, or are just burning holes in thin metal.

Also a small oxy-acetylene kit is worth considering. Cost = $300 new, + 100$ or so for accessories.
Oxy-acetylene brazing is how most custom-road-bicycle frame builders do it, though they use lugs. Fillet brazing is easier though, and looks so nice you don't need to grind the welds afterward.



(the practice of grinding down welds makes me cringe, since usually it is a way of hiding a poor weld. it shouldn't be necessary unless you are welding on a flat surface, that must be ground flat again afterwards).

 

[iven]

I have talked about this several times lol.

I bet in the last 10 years, I have had the oppertunity to pick up a decent TIG werlder, compleate with torch handle ,bottle & regulator at least 10 times I can remember.
Most of the older machines are a little larger & have Copper windings on the machines. I will call these machines pre 90's machines.
Lincoln, Lindy, Miller & Hobart all made decent Machines.
The older stuff may not have all the bells & whistles that the Modern ones have BUT.... should work well for what you guys are doing.
Always remember .... its a combo of things that make a good welder.
talent + reasonable equiptment= reasonable degree of success/ Nice welds.

Yea yea yea, anyone can weld .... Grandmaw can wirefeed , it would stick & it would look like Bird Do Do but it would indeed be a weld.
on the other hand, give the same welder to grandpaw , it would look like a nice weld , folks wouldn't snicker about it, instead mayby admire it and again it is just a weld .

So in the end , I guess ya have to ask your self...... " What do you want out of life. " and are you willing to settle on COMPLACENTCY ( i proably spelled that wrong lol... Im a welder not a speller ).

Folks are gonna see your stuff .... do you care that they might snicker about it ?? If not, go for it & make all the mess ya can stand yano. It's yours , who cares .

Back to buying a decent machine .... 500.00 to 1000.00 should get all the TIG welder you guys should need for a lifetime.
When you have the skills & the rite equiptment, it shouldn't take very long to pay for your new toy doing small side jobs. In the big picture , spending 1000.00 on a tool like this is a lifetime investment. How many years of your life do ya wana give away struggling with sub par equiptmnt ?? How much stuff do you wanna make a mess out of ?

My creedo about these things is "Anything worth doing is worth doing rite"

I have witnessed the " Never enough time time to do it rite the first time but alwayws time to do it rite a second time" or the " Do you want it done rite or do you want it done rite now lol kinda of mentality".
Buying LOW QUALITY, Cheep stuff is a certain reciept for a poor quality job or failures.

When your on a budget, you will have to DISAPLINE your self to think this way & mayby try to save for a year for this kinda purchase . This may sound tough, BUT IN the long run you will be better of for it & much HAPPYIER for doing it this way. Take that time to take some classes at your local Junior Collage or ROP, night school ect.
I hate cheeters ..... why cheet your self.

lol ... ok , now go buy that cheep welder ... sermon over ... some things you just have to learn for your self ... this is proably one of them.
Not BAGGING on ya ok ..... just wish there was a simple way to make everyone understand
Stephen

thanks man, some good advice..
i guess ill just invest into a cheap used welder and take it from there.. see what i can build :lol:

 

[Black Crown Tattoo]

Lincoln is fantastic for the home hobbyist!i built a full model an frame and all with a 400 Dollar Lincoln....skill has a bit to do with it but it's what I learned on as well! Lincoln mig don't buy cheap...if its cheap it's cheap...unles it's from a crack head! Then I might be cheap and a good deal!!!!

 

[october]

$100 dollars towards a crappy welder, could be $100 dollars towards a great quality welder...

I think you'll be happier if you were to wait, and save up the rest of the money, and buy a nice welder. It will only add to your frustration if you try to learn on subpar equipment. A Lincoln 140 is around $425ish brand new. And has the option to run gas. Sell some stuff on Craigslist, cash in bottles for money, ask for lowes gift cards for Christmas.
Just my thoughts...

october

 

[bonez]

Great advice Wingman, i totally agree.

Now, from experience a sub brand 80amp stick machine, aka buzzbox, its just junk. It will stick and burn through metal every chance it has, and ive used one for about 3 years, and yeah welding bicycle frames, as thats were/how i learned.
After that i upgraded with a 180amp buzzbox (which has a TIG plug as well BTW) and that was/is a great machine. Learnin with that piece of crap 80a was a good school thou, as my beads with the 180 were beautiful, rareley blew holes because of wider range of amp settings, and real hard to get the electrode stuck.

BUT!! If i had to get back at the time when i got the 180 buzzbox i would just get a MIG instead. I got a 180 digiMIG about a year later and trust me that is the best investment i ever did. Sorta pricey at about 1K, but since i wanted to do custom work on cars a MIG machine was mandatory, and you can trust me when i tell you that there is no comparison in practicality between a MMA and a MIG machine for welding bike frames. TIG is for perfectionists, and it can be said that is the Pro choice, but even if i have the machine i never felt the need to learn how to use it as MIG does perfect for me. Maybe when i'll be really good at it i will try.

Must be said that almost anybody can stick 2 pieces of metal togheter with a mig machine, but that doesnt make you a good fabricator. There are a lot of factors to a good weld, and first and most important is practice/xperience, and always pretend more from yourself.
Its a rather long and beaten to death topic, but if i had to suggest a newb a machine to do bike frames i would no doubt say MIG, and 160a minimum. If anything else cause once you get handy with it you'll have a more versatile machine that can do anything from a sheetmetal panel to an inch thick solid joint.

O/A is fun and all, but absolutley NOT easy. That is something i would really like to learn, much more than TIG.
Hope this helps.