Personally interesting "WWW" find...

[Mike G]

I was getting a little curious after being on a thread regarding somebody building a klunker, so naturally I referred to the MOMBAT site. While I was jumping around and checking out the "For Sale" section I stumbled across this:
http://www.mombat.org/MOMBAT/Bikes/1995_DanEd_Purp.html
This was designed and built by DanEd, a small company that was in Reading, PA, ultimately becoming ECycles. Now the reason I found this so personally interesting is my brother is a machinist since high school, he was machining parts for what was then DanEd on the side from his fulltime job... pretty sure this bike has a bunch of stuff my brother made for them. I actually got to ride the first prototype which rally wasn't all that impressive to me but these guys were really going outside the box. I'm not sure how many of the bikes were actually made if it was an even dozen I'd be surprised so it really shocked me to see one on MOMBAT. The companies spin into what became ECycles was another venture of thinking out of the box as they designed an electric motorcycle that was functional as well as looking aesthetically nice (picture a small c.c. sport bike)... ahead of what is now pretty common (electric motorcycles that is). Unfortunately like many great ideas, poor management prevented any of the ideas from coming to life as actual production items, although they now market a brushless electric motor line.

 

[user 135]

Cool story. I bet that Mombat would like to know a little more about Dan/Ed.

Still working on getting some more information on the Dan/Ed bikes so this is mostly from observation.

 

[Mike G]

Cool story. I bet that Mombat would like to know a little more about Dan/Ed.

Still working on getting some more information on the Dan/Ed bikes so this is mostly from observation.

Thanks, yea I saw that, I'm waiting to hear back from my brother and probably going to let him give them the skinny, if not Dan himself.
I also found this stuff, I believe my brother machined the crank arms they have:
http://mombat.org/MOMBAT/PartsForSalePages/crank_pedal_bb.html

That bike for sale is a few rev's from the original prototype, it didn't have the internally geared hub. The gearing on the prototype actually was enclosed and integrated on the frame around the crank housing, still using the belt drive. They were attempting to keep the cost down by using square tubing on the frame and as it was explained to me, easier to jig and weld.

 

[Bicycle808]

Yeah, i've been admiring that bike for a while now... awesome that your brother might have had a hand in it!

 

[Mike G]

Yeah, i've been admiring that bike for a while now... awesome that your brother might have had a hand in it!

Yeah but at $2500 I wouldn't admire it too much, nothing very prolific about it beyond the belt drive. All the innovation was in the first prototype and most of it was streamlined away for "off the shelf" stuff like the IG rear hub. Rare? Yes, but only because it never went into true production beyond a dozen bikes, if that. The big rubber block rear elastomer was pretty cool, rode a bit like the early Proflex bikes... don't know what the longevity of it would have been like though.

The worst part about finding this was at that time the few bikes were made, I was all about hardcore MTB'ing, going to the festivals at Jim Thorpe, Snowshoe (West by god Virginia). Dan, the Dan in DanEd, was going to hook me up with one of the first bikes to haul to the different events and play quasi spokesman... never happened! I think my brother conveyed my thoughts on the prototype and it probably didn't go over very well?

 

[user 135]

Curious about the bottom bracket design. Why reinvent it with the hexagon BB axle?

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[Bicycle808]

Yeah but at $2500 I wouldn't admire it too much, nothing very prolific about it beyond the belt drive. All the innovation was in the first prototype and most of it was streamlined away for "off the shelf" stuff like the IG rear hub. Rare? Yes, but only because it never went into true production beyond a dozen bikes, if that. The big rubber block rear elastomer was pretty cool, rode a bit like the early Proflex bikes... don't know what the longevity of it would have been like though.

The worst part about finding this was at that time the few bikes were made, I was all about hardcore MTB'ing, going to the festivals at Jim Thorpe, Snowshoe (West by god Virginia). Dan, the Dan in DanEd, was going to hook me up with one of the first bikes to haul to the different events and play quasi spokesman... never happened! I think my brother conveyed my thoughts on the prototype and it probably didn't go over very well?

I think it was ahead of its time, not just b/c of the belt drive (which is something i don't like, but this may have been the first belt-drive MTB), but also b/c it was one of the earliest MTBs to use a modern (at the time) IGH. '95 was a time when MTB innovation was in full swing, and folks were scrutinizing the pros/cons of things that had been taken for granted earlier. Were chains the answer? How long were we going to put up with rear derailers, and their tendency to get beat up by stumps, roots, and rocks? The DanEd bike didn't exactly answer those questions, but it displayed some interesting possibilities....

I do believe that your skepticism about the design's viability in the market would definitely sour ol' Dan's enthusiasm about making you a sponsor/rep/spokesperson for the brand, and understandably so. Probably would've been cooler if your brother hadn't mentioned it.

Curious about the bottom bracket design. Why reinvent it with the hexagon BB axle?

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By '95, MTBers were already complaining about the strength and stiffness of good ol' square taper cranks. Anyone who has ridden square taper hard offroad can tell you that, in time, the l'il square hole in your crankarms will get round around the edges. Also, by the mid nineties, tires were getting wider, rear ends were getting wider, and triple cranks had to be pushed even further out to clear the tires and line up with the cassette. These longer BB spindles could be noticeably flexy under a strong rider. By '97, Shimano introduced Hollowtech I, and the rest of the industry followed with ISIS. But, prior, only boutique component manufacturers (eg, Sweet Wings) were offering splined cranks for MTB use. I imagine that DanEd was trying to be a boutique manufacturer of bike parts; the hex BB seems (to me) more prone to rounding off, but it should theoretically have been stiffer? Of course, with a single-ring front and a 45mm or so chainline, the spindle would need not be very long....

 

[Mike G]

"I do believe that your skepticism about the design's viability in the market would definitely sour ol' Dan's enthusiasm about making you a sponsor/rep/spokesperson for the brand, and understandably so. Probably would've been cooler if your brother hadn't mentioned it."
Oh I'm not certain that was the case as I wasn't in the Reading area at that time, which I'm sure contributed and my brother didn't discuss much with him beyond the machined parts he was doing. You have to realize this guy Dan is what I'd refer to as a "true engineering savant", lots of real out of the box thinking but not a lot of business sense or people skills back then, he tended to whiz a lot of people off. He'd concept something bring some people on for a while and before anything came to fruition most would have already left, be it cause they hadn't been paid, or God forbid, think something in the design process should be changed. He could be very condescending towards anyone who'd have the audacity to question any technical aspect, which is more than likely why the bikes never made into any larger production numbers. The company now has distanced itself from any kind of toys and now into brushless electric motors and stuff like that, http://www.ecycle.com/#!... they even have a board of directors, pretty sure to keep Dan in check

 

[Bicycle808]

That's interesting info; I also think i recall reading either on mombat or in Dirt Rag that there was also a situation where they went in on a lot of billet with Cannondale, and Cannondale ripped them off on the deal.... or I might have my wires crossed, thinking about some other maker.... but I could see how getting beat for a lot of money and/or raw material could kinda nip the bike thing in the bud...