Vintage Bike Chains

[Wade]

Do you guys mind weighing in and giving me some information on vintage bicycle chains? I recently tried to mount what I thought was a vintage 1" pitch skip tooth chain on a 1930's Packard. The Packard came with this chain on it but the bicycle was not rideable and the wheels are about shot. After weeks of slowly and lovingly working on the bike, I was quite dismayed when I installed the chain and it sounded like grinding gears when pedaling. Upon closer inspection I could tell the chain didn't sit quite right on the sprocket nor the cog and when I compared it to a regular skip tooth chain it was obvious the pitch was longer than 1".

I started researching other chains and I've known of the Wipperman but can anyone give me some info on what I may have? The cog does look different on the back wheel which was on the bicycle when I bought it with the teeth set forward at an angle. As I said, the pitch is a slight bit longer and the width of the chain is a hair more than a skip tooth. This bicycle also has what I would assume is the original sweetheart sprocket as I believe the bike to be an early 1930's Schwinn-built Packard. Whomever was riding this was okay with the chain sitting not quite right on this sprocket for who know how many years but I do think the chain traveled smoothly on the original cog. The cog is set onto a Morrow hub.

I realize I am asking many questions which you veterans are probably rolling your eyes about and I appreciate the information anyone may provide. I just always have had nothing but normal 1" and 1/2" pitch chains. We all have to learn this stuff sometime!

 

[KJV]

I w as at bicycle museum: few weeks ago. The chain,, on the cycles' from
Early 1900s: looked a bit bigger.

 

[horsefarmer]

Are you sure the chain is just not really worn and stretched out? Try laying the chain out flat on a table and compress all the links together, measure and then stretch the links out and measure again.
I have seen some really worn chains that can "grow" by several inches.

 

[G-Matt]

At some point a chain is stretched so bad it becomes no good anymore


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[deorman]

I would guess that the "angled" teeth are worn out. Is it a "block" chain or "roller" construction (i.e. plates and round bushings?) They are not interchangable.

 

[horsefarmer]

Here is pic of worn out sprocket.

 

[Wade]

The cog is not worn out. I'll post an image of it later. The chain is also not stretched. It's made wider and the pitch is different. These are all good suggestions but this chain and cog are not the standard dimensions as seen on most of other chains.

 

[user 135]

1" x 3/16" instead of 1/8" ? OR is it Block Chain? Pics might help.

Common chain sizes
1/2" x 1/8" "single" for track, BMX, cruiser bikes, one-speed, three-speeds, and the rare derailleur bike.
1/2" x 3/32" "shifting" for road, hybrid, mtb bikes, single-speed and 5-, 6-, 7-speed freewheels
1/2" x 5/64" "narrow" for any bike with 9- or 10-speed cassettes
1" x 3/16" "skip tooth" for old-time bikes with inch-pitch sprockets
1/2" x 3/16" "heavy duty" for BMX, Worksman and exercise bikes

 

[deven_science]

About a third of skiptooth chains I buy are stretched out. They were 1" pitch originally, but time and kids pumping those pedals hard elongate the chain slightly. I have a beautiful block chain that I want to use on my Racycle, but it's stretched. I'm trying to find someone willing and able to make me a custom skiptooth chainring that's 1 1/32" pitch, just so I can use it.

 

[SILVERKINGPC]

Stretched and worn most likely. Pics? The chain and sprocket, coming from different bikes might make it ride high. Or, maybe the chain is made up of links from many different stretched chains to make one. Or, you have the sprocket tooth in the wrong hole! Mysterious!

 

[Wade]

Here are a few photos of the cog and the chain. I have searched and searched online images of Diamond 1" pitch chains and skip tooth chain and have found no others with the numbers on there. Maybe I'm not looking in the right place? Has anyone seen the numbers ("19" or "61", not sure which one) on the Diamond chain before? As I've stated above, I'm learning this stuff and maybe they all have the numbers but I can't seem to find the numbers on other online chains anywhere and none of the other 4 Diamond brand chains I own have the numbers.

To me, the cog looks like it was angled forward by factory methods. I know it has worn to a great degree to perhaps accentuate the angle but you can plainly see some chroming still on the teeth which would perhaps suggest this is not simply worn down to this appearance. Also, I'm sure the "B" is helpful to those in the know. This is a Morrow hub just so that is stated again.

Any thoughts?

DSC_4428 by hawk_eye_photography, on Flickr

DSC_4470 by hawk_eye_photography, on Flickr

DSC_4477 by hawk_eye_photography, on Flickr

 

[horsefarmer]

Pretty sure that sprocket is just wore out.

 

[The Black Monark]

Cog is marked B for Bendix and is shot. As noted above chances are the chain is worn too. If you were to put a new chain on that cog you'd likely have trouble. Remedy is replace chain and cog.

http://www.sheldonbrown.com/chains.html

 

[Wade]

I am not so much disputing that. But that cog is not even at the heart of my post. The pictured cog is the original one from the bicycle and from a worn out wheel which I'm never going to use. The chain somewhat fits this cog but does not fit at all the sweetheart sprocket which was on the bicycle nor the cog of several other sets of wheels.

The chain and it's differing pitch is what this post is about so you can disregard how you feel about the cog, lol. I simply posted the cog pics to help with the chain identification.

 

[The Black Monark]

The noise you've described while pedaling is indicative of a worn drive train, complete or components.
If a chain is "stretched" it will not sit right on a chain ring, it will look loose and will sag.
Can you post a picture of the chain on the chain ring?

 

[Wade]

Cog is marked B for Bendix and is shot. As noted above chances are the chain is worn too. If you were to put a new chain on that cog you'd likely have trouble. Remedy is replace chain and cog.

http://www.sheldonbrown.com/chains.html

I've replaced everything - new chain and different wheel set with the original sweetheart sprocket and the bicycle currently rides like a champ. Nobody is answering what I'm asking.

I agree the cog is most likely shot. The question is the chain. I do not subscribe to the theory that it's simply stretched. The chain is marked differently - see the image above - than I have seen and the pitch isn't just slightly off as would be the case with a stretched out chain. The master link and chain is also wider than a normal skip tooth 1" pitch chain.

 

[Wade]

And it's pretty obvious why the grinding noises were occurring. I also addressed that above. I do appreciate the help and I'm not an expert at all on these matters but I'm also not an ....., lol. I know this chain and this sprocket and cog do not match up. I'm trying to figure out what the origins of the chain are at this point and I do not believe it's simply a stretched out 1" pitch Diamond chain.

 

[The Black Monark]

You could contact Diamond chain and ask them:

http://www.diamondchain.com/
I've telephoned before and they're very helpful.

 

[Wade]

That's a great suggestion! Thanks!

 

[deorman]

My suspicion is that you may have a replacement roller chain for a block chain system; They (and the later 1" pitch roller) were quite popular for racing even when store bikes were all 1/2" pitch, but not necessarily interchangable.