What if? 26" white letter Goodyear Eagle drag slick

[Lonewolf]

DougC. That's some good info, but I already went through this whole issue with a motorized bicycle tank we were looking to do. We crunched the numbers and the 20' container is about dead on. -Costs $3,000 to have one shipped to southern Cali from China. I had warehousing and billing all wrapped up. Just not enough money or foreseen profit on the other side.
It was only $3,800 for a blow mold set up. We would have had to sell 1000 units before we started seeing a substantial profit and a little over 1000 fit in a 20" box.

I am taking a different approach, here. Keep it US. From China, shipping is always about the same as the unit cost. Let the guy make the mold and keep it. He currently makes pie crust motorcycle drag tires. I'm not into the pie crust look but I can understand if a lot of you are. I promise Cody will hear about the pie crust idea as well. He is probably more inclined to do that, than to do a smooth wall. I'm not looking to make any money on this, though that would be nice. I just want some dedicated, real Rat Rod bicycle tires.

If you do a google image search, almost 40% of the pictures that show up under "Rat Rod" are bicycles.

I really dig the horse kart tire- it just needs to be beefier.

I wouldn't be surprised if Cody has already seen this thread.

I may have the day off today, so if this is the case, I will give him a call.

 

[Spincycle]

Lonewolf, I think there's two ways to go. A 24" or 26" tire, with probably a max width of 2.35" for "standard" frames. OR a 24" or 26" tire in a 3"+ width for custom applications. The latter would be geared more for wide rim applications. I would venture to say that most of the people on the forum would buy the standard version. Having said that. In my opinion you would aceive your original idea with the custom tire. As it would be wider you could make it taller. I don't think you would want to make the skinnier 2.35" too tall or it would be "flimsy".

My vote would be for a pie crust type sidewall. I haven't seen a bike tire like that and it would bring us closer to that hot/rat rod style we all like so much. Otherwise the Cart tire would be your direct competitor and it would come down to price. I think you would be missing a big opportunity if you didn't offer a white wall version. If someone wanted a solid black wall tire they could easily just sand off any lettering you chose to have molded on there.

 

[Chainsaw]

Herr, I realize that having to do your own lettering on a tire might be out of the realm for some of the guys (I'm probably one of them) but I believe that this should be an option at the very least. A true custom build will have alot of it's builder's influence built into it. How detracting is it too have a gorgeous bike that is wearing tires with a great big bike manufaturers logo on the sidewall or something that just doesn't fit the theme of the build. There are screen printers out there that can put any name or logo you want on a tire.
As far as people wanting to promote a corporation image on their project, sure some will gladly to do so and that's fine, but just as many or more will find another way to to keep from using the products logo. Whether it's sanding the logo off, painting over the logo or simply buying from a different manufacturer, it's gonna happen. And I feel it's gonna happen more often than not.

As far as size ...
If you know me you'll know that there are very few who don't love "exageration" in the builds more than me! But at the same time, I hate looking over a bike, seeing how much time, effort and imagination was put into it and then seeing that it's unrideable! Very few of our FreakBikes are unrideable. And when I say our bikes ARE rideable, I don't mean that they were coasted down the hill in your driveway or peddled down to the first stop sign. I'm talking about average cruises of 8 miles or more, all year long!
If you want a real exageration of tire size, used motorcycle or auto tires are available for next to nothing anywhere you look.
When I was referring to Dolly and her training bra, I was referring to the look of a lot of the 3 inchers crammed onto the small rims. After a certain point they become more ballony than than having that "meat on the ground" look. If you're gonna have a true "Squared off" slick than make sure it's a squared off slick, not some bloated chunk of rubber. Also not too many of the guys on the forum have the means to widen or custom build a rear end that could house a monster tire.
I've ridden several big tired bikes and the one constant with them all is that they are a pain to ride for any distant. Eric Hannan's bike are the exception, but then you're paying for that comfortable feeling and there motorcycle tires not squared off. Most of the bikes that have used an auto tire have cornering techniques uncommon to a regular bike. Run a squared tire bike and you better be strong enough to wrestle it around every corner!
Thanks for the response! I think that this type of debate can only help to propel Lonewolf in the direction of all the possible needs that will take his idea to the next level!

 

[Lonewolf]

Chainsaw and Spincycle. Thanks for the thoughtful input. I hope it happens. Understand, I'm not claiming this project as my own.

I'm not trying to get paid, nor claim credit or the project as my own. With thoughtful input like you guys have just contributed, this is all of our project. I'm just trying to get it done so we can have them available.

Yes, true flat tread is a crazy ride.


What do you guys think about the center peak? The ride characteristic there would be that it would flop into a specific lean angle but then not want to go much further. -I've roasted enough super-bike tire edges to have an intimate knowledge. Riding on cones isn't the easiest, but it's better than riding on flats.

 

[Chainsaw]

Kinda like the little ridge that the old hotwheels rode on? Getting the least amount of actual tire to the pavement while still giving the allusion of mucho ground meat? That's the best possible way to get these tires to be functionally ......! There might be a lean charcteristic but I think that would be pretty easy for most of us to adapt to. Plus we're not talking about any high speed tragedies happening. If it leans to far to one side, the we just need to shift all the crap in our pockets to the other side! :mrgreen:

 

[Lonewolf]

Okay. I was right. Cody had already peeped in here to look at the thread.

I just talked with him on the phone for at least 30 minutes. Two words: Nice Guy.

He shared a lot of the process with me and I was impressed to say the least. One thing that has to be mentioned first ,is the amount of time this takes to make each copy. With what he told me I'm gonna estimate an hour and a half, total, for each example. This is significant.

Going this route (retread) may even require that I cast the molds-personally. Luckily, it's not rocket science and I have a mad scientist twin brother, certainly capable of it.

I'll keep you guys updated.

 

[herr_rudolf]

Good to hear, Lonewolf! 8)

@ Chainsaw

Lettering.
I hear you. Blackwalls would be best, I agree. But I really like Lonewolfs initial idea of offering a decent well detailed dragslick for a bicycle including oversized lettering. (and as a graphic designer that loves lettershapes I probably won't even care what the text is about..) And I have never come across an example of 'homemade' tire lettering. Do you know what kind of paint to use? I did come across some not-so-good executed homemade whitewalls on hotrodforums... I just don't believe in homemade lettering until I see I fine example...
Sanding off white lettering to create a homemade blackwall sounds a lot easier...

Tallness of a tire.
Yes. It definately shouldn't be rediculous ofcourse, and it definately must be rideable. Maybe a grooved 'cheaterslick' is the right option... Engineered in a way that part of the tire that touches the ground is round but still has the squared-off edges. Like Electra tires, but maybe a bit more extreme and with much stiffer sidewalls.

But I read that the idea without the oversized lettering comes VERY close to the horsecartwheel tire. So I guess we're safe. It's just that we don't want Lonewolf to re-invent the (horsecart-)wheel, do we..? :wink:

If the new tire's gonna cost twice as much (or more), it better has some good points to differ from that what's already available.

 

[Spincycle]

I don't think you'll be able to pass a "center ridge" for a drag slick. Either you make it flat and deal with the ride. Or your just making another cruiser tire to add to the list. If it looks as killer as I think it could, people will be willing to compromise a little when cornering. I'm also asuming this would be a tire for rear wheel applications only. How cool would they look on a trike too!!!

 

[outskirtscustoms]

I know a guy on Fleabay that can custom cut rims like those too! Expensive but it'd be KILLER!

 

[Chainsaw]

Herr,
I like the idea of a fictitous manufacturers name printed on the sidewall ( Badyear, Dumlop, etc.) or even Lonewolf's own company name. That in itself gives it the custom feature that will make it stand out (at least for awhile). What I don't wanna see is something similar to the "Lowrider" tires. It looks rediculous even on a lowrider and the tires are worthless (looks wise) on anything but a lowrider type of bike.
Whether the tire is promoting RRB or some other site or group, the tires could/should be special ordered by that particular group. But for the sake of the entire bicycle custom hobby an offering of a basic tire is needed.
We show our bikes at Detroit's Autorama and I see tires that are custom lettered all the time (also amongst the car guys). Most of the bikes have been lettered by some type of pinstriper or sign painter. Not sure what type of paint most use, but one of the guys did a friends bike last year using the same paint he pinstripes with. Search for ScrappyRon's Murdered Murray in the RRB threads. The bike was ridden most of the summer with no signicant wear on the lettering.
If I were to have something like this done, I would definitely find a screen printer capable of doing the job. There's also a process similar to screen printing but uses a silicone cone/blob to press the ink onto the product. I believe this would be better. Look up Press-A-Print for a better idea of this process. I wish I could remember the technical name for this type of printing There are large commercial versions of this process out there and it is a big industry. Being a graphic designer, you probably know what I'm talking about and could explain this better.

 

[Chainsaw]

I don't think you'll be able to pass a "center ridge" for a drag slick. Either you make it flat and deal with the ride. Or your just making another cruiser tire to add to the list. If it looks as killer as I think it could, people will be willing to compromise a little when cornering. I'm also asuming this would be a tire for rear wheel applications only. How cool would they look on a trike too!!!

I think the "center ridge" could be done in a way that the general public would not be able to detect without a staight edge or something similar. I don't think it would take much to get most of the friction off of the pavement. But I could be wrong on this.
The other aspect is that even a true "squared" slick of bicycle tire porportions isn't gonna give much resistence when turning. Keeping things into perspective will make the turning less noticeable. But jack it up to anything larger than three inches and you better hit the gym before each ride!
For those of us crazy enough to put one on the front of our bikes .... well ... we know the consequences. :wink: And yeah I'd give it a try!

 

[Spincycle]

The drag slick with a red line around the side wall would also be cool. Like the Troy Lee Thick Brick.

 

[herr_rudolf]

@ Chainsaw

You're right. And you've brought up some memories too: Years ago I got turned off seeing 'lowrider' printed on a 20" whitewall tire I 'needed' for my folding-bike. I ended up NOT buying the tires because of that... (But strangely enough, to this day they still are 'bestsellers'. We mustn't underestimate corporaty powers...) Though I think in the dragslick-case it's a bit different. As rediculous as black lowrider-lettering on a whitewall is, to me a blackwall dragslick just isn't really complete without oversized white or yellow lettering...

Finding a screenprinter that is capable to do it probably won't be the problem, I think finding one that is WILLING to do that in one print run, expecially for me (or for you), for a fair price, will be... If you're not able to print/paint realistic white lettering yourself it becomes a moneyproblem. Ofcourse I don't know for sure but I'm guessing the guys you're talking about probably have lot's of money put into their rides, and their custom one-off tires. Factory stock white lettering still sounds like the cheapest way to me. But I hope I'm wrong and see some pics soon with succesful homemade lettering.

I'm still having no luck finding ScrappyRon's Murdered Murray though...

 

[yeshoney]

OK, i watched this thread to see if their was enough interest to repost the pics i took of all my vintage tires. i particulary like the piecrust edge as well as a number of other sidewall styles. By combining these sidewall styles with a Slick tire with a more squared off profile would create a super smooth look. here are the sidewall pics that I have:

 

[herr_rudolf]

:shock: 8) :shock: 8) :shock:

Some of em look pretty squared-off to me.
What a great collection...

 

[Spincycle]

Here's where I would start to make home made lettering. I haven't tried this stuff, but it seems to be the right product. I wonder if you could print your design on an adhesive sheet in your printer. Cut it out, stick it to the tire, paint the stuff on then peel off the stencil? You may have to score around the stencil before removal though. http://www.rangerpaint.com

 

[herr_rudolf]

hmm, their promotional 'photos' are far from convincing to be honest. But for 10 bucks I'd be willing to try the stuff...

I guess making a mask should not be a problem. A print of the design, a piece of sticky vinyl, an x-acto knife, and a steady hand should take care of that:
Lightly sprayglue the print onto the vinyl, cut it out. Carefully remove the paperprint, as well as the vinyl letters. Use masking tape to transfer the vinyl mask onto the tire, and start painting...

I did my tankplate-graphic on my cartboardtracker that way:

viewtopic.php?f=21&t=16826&st=0&sk=t&sd=a&start=45

 

[Lonewolf]

Cody places thermoset decals into the mold before the rubber wrapped carcass goes in. His full color decals are made with the tires.


Nice pis of all the side walls, but if I have to come up with the actual mold, don't expect anything more than a nice smooth profile.

This won't be seeing a cnc machine. It will be old world all the way using turned ash or fur with 1250 degree aluminum poured over it on a steel flat table, with formers. Detail? What detail?

Tell ya what, though. If I have anything to do with it, it will be cool.

 

[ratina]

I think a lot of people here would want 26x2.125 or even 26x2.5 if possible, pie crust slicks. I know I would buy some if the price is right.

I wouldnt want any lettering on the sidewall, either black wall, white wall, or a white or red stripe would be cool

I hope you can get these made and keep the price reasonable!

 

[Lonewolf]

Another consideration. Price. That is probably gonna kill this whole thing.

I was after some cool tires for a build I wanted to do, but acceptable tires don't exist. Look, I love pie crust Coopers all day long on a steel '32 highboy.

I was not looking for pie crusts on my bike.

What I may end up doing is contacting a real bicycle tire manufacturer and shoving all this down their throat.

One thing is that Cody said there were a lot of people wanting to purchase a $500 motorcycle slick, but when he actually spent the money to make one, everyone vanished.

I don't think the market would bare over $50-$80. I might as well go to the guys who know what they are doing and appeal to them to do both versions discussed here.

I see we are actually having more than one conversation, here.