Help a beginner redish a wheel.

[yoothgeye]

Generally I've shyed away from messing with spokes or lacing a wheel. I've done some trueing, but that's about it.

I read a long time ago on the old How to make a fixie thread that for the best results you needed to redish the wheel if you are using a wheel that had a freehwheel cassette. The advice (as I remember it) was to loosen the non-drive side spokes half a turn and tighten the drive side spokes half a turn... is that right?

Anyway, I am turning a 24" alloy mountain bike wheel into a single speed wheel with a BMX freewheel. I was wondering if the wheel has 2 different length spokes to accomplish the dishing for the cassette freewheel? If so, could I just take another matching wheel and swap out one side spokes so that I have all the same length spokes to rebuild the wheel?

Am I explaining this right?

HELP!!!

 

[user 135]

Yes you have the concept down. It may take more or less turns. You may need to respace your axle to.
http://www.63xc.com/dennb/redish.htm

 

[yoothgeye]

Thank you, now about the spokes. This is just a wheel off of a box store mountain bike. On the drive side the spokes look almost straight going from rim to hub, on the other side they going outward toward the hub. So was this done with adjustment or unequal length spokes? Sure, I could go take the wheel apart, but then I wouldn't be sitting in here eating a bowl of pasta.

Another thing. When lacing a wheel I saw someone going around and around the wheel tensioning the spokes, but coming from a car background where I've been taught to torque bolts back and forth, not in a circle to keep from warping, which is right on a bike?

 

[user 135]

Usually they are equal length. Best is take one from each side out to find out. Or look to see if there is dramatic difference in the threads showing at the nipple.

Going around in the circle won't hurt as it allows the rim to gently move all at once. The spokes are what keep the rim in true.

 

[ifitsfreeitsforme]

I have put bmx freewheels on three bikes so far that had 10 or 12 speed freewheels on them (27" wheels). I did not have to redish the wheels. I was able to get a good chainline on all of them. Are you sure you have to redish the wheel? Just asking in a friendly manner, not questioning your abilities.

 

[yoothgeye]

I have put bmx freewheels on three bikes so far that had 10 or 12 speed freewheels on them (27" wheels). I did not have to redish the wheels. I was able to get a good chainline on all of them. Are you sure you have to redish the wheel? Just asking in a friendly manner, not questioning your abilities.

I too have spun a single freewheel on a few different wheels with no chainline problems, I'm actually doing this for appearance.

 

[cashman]

Regardless of the hub configuration, you probably want the rim to ride in the center of the frame. If you need to move the rim to the left or right a little, it is perfectly ok to loosen the left or the right side spokes.(every other spoke will either be left or right). Just don't go overboard with the number of twists you give each spoke and remember if you loosen say the right side spokes a half turn then tighten the left side spokes an equal amount. I always start at the valve hole and usually only give each nipple a half turn at a time and keep checking for overall true after I have either loosened or tightened the right or left side after each full rotation of the wheel and adjust acordingly.

 

[yoothgeye]

Regardless of the hub configuration, you probably want the rim to ride in the center of the frame. If you need to move the rim to the left or right a little, it is perfectly ok to loosen the left or the right side spokes.(every other spoke will either be left or right). Just don't go overboard with the number of twists you give each spoke and remember if you loosen say the right side spokes a half turn then tighten the left side spokes an equal amount. I always start at the valve hole and usually only give each nipple a half turn at a time and keep checking for overall true after I have either loosened or tightened the right or left side after each full rotation of the wheel and adjust acordingly.

Thank you.

Now all I need to do is see if this wheel has same length spokes on each side.

 

[largek9]

This is a great thread,I've laced afew wheels and have been LUCKY ! The weird thing is I'm about to build a wheel for a road bike I'm building and this came at just the right time a good refresher thanks Tom

 

[Bendix]

Generally I've shyed away from messing with spokes or lacing a wheel. I've done some trueing, but that's about it.

I read a long time ago on the old How to make a fixie thread that for the best results you needed to redish the wheel if you are using a wheel that had a freehwheel cassette. The advice (as I remember it) was to loosen the non-drive side spokes half a turn and tighten the drive side spokes half a turn... is that right?

Anyway, I am turning a 24" alloy mountain bike wheel into a single speed wheel with a BMX freewheel. I was wondering if the wheel has 2 different length spokes to accomplish the dishing for the cassette freewheel? If so, could I just take another matching wheel and swap out one side spokes so that I have all the same length spokes to rebuild the wheel?

Am I explaining this right?

HELP!!!

If I've read this correctly you are indeed respacing the rear axle? If not, dishing will not accomplish anything as it only moves the rim in relation to the hub locknuts, it doesn't move the freewheel itself in or out. :wink:

Theoretically you could use 36 different spoke lengths, and as long as you didn't bottom the threads you could (eventually) build a perfectly good, properly dished wheel. Different length spokes don't accomplish dishing, they just facilitate it by making the end result easier and faster using a uniform, easily repeatable assembly process.

 

[yoothgeye]

I can do this!

 

[Jawon]

Not sure if im understanding but maybe this will address a few of your q's...

Spokes on either side are diff lengths. You need to carefully measure the hub and rim dimensions in order to figure out the correct length (there are spoke calculators online, u wont b able to figure it out on your own). If u r off u will not b a happy camper having to start all over!

If u will b replacing spokes on just the drive side i think u will have to basically start from scratch due to the standard process for 3 cross patterns. Otherwise u may have to do a lot of gentle spoke bending.

If the rim is not one of the modern machined kind it could be very buckled (ie hard for a first wheelbuild). It is indeed an art. Too many nuances to explain in a forum but allot enough time, be methodical and be willing to loosen the spokes again and start over. I think tightening around in a circle is ok until u get to the fine tuning.

Good luck!

 

[ozzmonaut]

All I know is be careful what wheel you take apart. I took apart an old 30's wheel to paint the rim. When I started it was such a nice straight wheel. One the spokes were out that rim was so warped it looked like it was about to fold. I laced it up and was never able to get it right again. I would just skip dishing the wheel, adjust the axle spacing and see where you're at.

 

[Bendix]

Spokes on either side are diff lengths. You need to carefully measure the hub and rim dimensions in order to figure out the correct length (there are spoke calculators online, u wont b able to figure it out on your own). If u r off u will not b a happy camper having to start all over!

Yes they are often different (primarily on multi speed rear hubs), but it's good to know WHY they are different lengths (and why it doesn't really matter).

Say the spoke lengths are different, one side is a millimeter or two shorter or longer, and you are building wheels in a sensible, uniform, repeatable way. You start by lacing your pattern and turning ALL the nipples until 1 spoke thread is showing. Now you proceed to adding 'layers' of tension by tightening ALL the spokes a turn or two at a time, truing your wheel, stressing it, and adding more 'layers' of tension by tightening ALL of the spokes each time (even if it's only a fraction of a turn) until you are satisfied. If the spokes are different lengths you will automatically be closer to your final dish, saving time. If the spokes are all the same length you would simply need to turn ALL the spokes on ONE side a couple additional turns to compensate and pull the rim that way. No big deal. A nipple and spoke are nothing more than a nut and bolt with a usable range of several millimeters, the finished wheel has no idea what length you used. :wink:

What if you get the "wrong" length? Well, how wrong is "wrong"? Sure, if you're a professional you would want everything to be 'just so' and your customers would expect an aesthetically 'right' wheelset. BUT, especially for RR bikes, if there's a spoke thread or two showing, or you had to grind off a couple threads on the inside (or both!) does that matter? No. Not at all. Don't worry about it. Go ride the heck out of your new wheels.

 

[yoothgeye]

Thanks Bendix!

 

[kingfish254]

I can do this!

YOU CAN DOO EEEET!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j29SZIx1Ne4