Bicycle getting hit by car

[skoda]

Critical Mass is different in every city, some are peaceful some are more in your face.

It is designed to promote cycling awareness, usually it involves blocking traffic to let the bikes have the right of way, through intersections, where ever. Not all CM events do this, but that's the norm from what I know.

Regardless of whether they were looking for trouble, nobody deserves to be subjected to vehicular assault. Clearly, the guy in the car was an idiot and there is no excuse for what he did.

 

[Anonymous]

Nice job turning this around to make it the cyclist's fault. Which forum am I on again?

mastershaker by no means do i think the driver use the right judgement!!!


but once anger feeds anger! i really can see both sides. come on though it's common courtesy get out of the way. if you want to spread the word of awareness wear bright clothes, hold some kind of open public fourm, pass out flyers. "you'll get more with honey then you get with vinegar"

 

[DiscoStu]

I've lived in a few different cities and all of them had CM rides. I used to participate in these when I was a regular bike commuter for the "awareness" aspect of cycling. There were alot of us getting hit and or buzzed by cars in Seattle and Portland. I stopped riding in CM when a more radical form of raising awareness started becoming pervasive, which is as apparent now in the twin cities as it was in Seattle and Portland.

I have personally been spit on, hit 3 times by cars, yelled at, cursed at, forced off the road into ditches and curbs, as well as many other unpleasantries while biking/commuting and once at a CM ride. I have been a part of CM rides where I saw my fellow riders; kick cars, start fights, vandalize public and private property, curse at cars who were following traffic laws as we passed, cursed at walking pedestrians who did nothing as we passed and pedestrians who had the right of way in a cross walks who were spit on and cursed at. I have also seen agressive drivers at CM rides, people honking and gesturing provocatively, as well as yelling and cursing at our group and threating violence themselves.

You can google CM and you'll get tons of stories on both sides of the issue. I'm on a couple of other cycling boards and CM discussions come up reguarly and tend to get heated quickly. As in this thread.

And for full disclosure,I'm no angel here, I've lost my temper and cursed out motorists, been quick to flip the bird, heated exchanges at stop lights while on my bike as well. To my credit, I've been diligent about following traffic laws, and am of the belief that if CM were to follow all local traffic laws for bicycles, they would do a much better job of raising awareness.

There are right minded people who are wise enough to say they don't know what happened before the incident in the video in question. In this clip, I think the car went overboard whether provoked or unprovoked. The CM riders were clearly not following traffic laws unless their local laws allow them to change lanes without signaling, riding multiple abreast, not staying to the right, impeding traffic, etc. I do not believe CM is as legit as they think themselves to be. Follow the laws and demand the same of the motorists!

My $.02

 

[schwinnmesa]

Sorry guys for posting the first video, I had no clue what a critical mass was. All my view was at the time was anger at the motorist who hit the bike. I had no clue it would turn out to hardcore debate.... but you guys are smart and know a lot of politics and history! 8)

 

[CCR]

Sorry guys for posting the first video...

There were no bad intentions, no need to be sorry man

 

[Korporal]

If I respond to your comment it isn’t because I don't like you, it's because you wrote something that struck a chord with me.

i can't put them in the same arena as the greats fighting for civil rights [...] gettin in the way and being a problem is not the solution.

I only used "the greats fighting for civil rights" as an example because it isn't obscure, and they were a group who were quite the nuisance at the time of their protest but, have gone down in history as revolutionaries. Getting in the way draws attention to oneself and, hopefully, a problem of sorts. Making PSA's, having a 5k run, and posting flyers at the local coffee shop don't express the same amount of urgency that blocking roads during the evening commute carries.

anger feeds anger.

The most influential book on morals in western Christian society (which the US is a part of) is the Bible. At the risk of losing what little credibility I have, I'll say this: The New Testament would agree with you. The Old Testament would not. Depends how you reconcile the difference between the two.

... I challenge you to make a (short) list of history makers who did not cause trouble.

... :? Thats too broad my friend and I dont know if I could meet your standards. I sorely decline.

That was a poor question asked in an attempt to lure you one direction, in which, I already had my counter argument polished and ready for deployment.

so the "MAN" wants them under his thumb and has some underlying Conspiracy to oppress the bikers of cali.

No conspiracy. Just cyclist awareness in hopes of not getting pinched between a parked car and somebody turning right without signaling or checking. And it’s in more states than California.

i bet 100 dollars if you compared whatever they were "protesting" to human rights to the chick in the blazer when it was going on. she would have popped somebody..

See my above comment on why I choose civil rights as a comparison. It was not a passive decision or an attempt to bring the two causes to the same level.

please post any other links on what they are about. i don't want to have a half informed view

Any report (about anything) you encounter has inherent bias built in. The creator of the report will try to eliminate or exaggerate that bias (depending on their purpose). Having people post links will further this bias as (now this one has been empirically proven by experimental psychologists) nobody wants to be wrong. Because of this, the links you will receive will be biased towards the posters argument. I applaud you for requesting more information. However, I challenge you to obtain it yourself.

it is entirely within the realm of possibility that these CM people staged the whole scene [...] another video of these "people" on Youtube

While it's entirely within the realm of possibility that the collision was staged, it's also entirely in the realm of possibility that there's a spaceship full of donkeys aimlessly hurtling through space and beaming root beer into the oceans of the universe. Just because it's suggested and not disprovable, doesn't mean that it's true. How did CM riders lose their status as .... Sapien Sapiens and become merely imitations of people?

If you want to know anymore, try your local CL bike classifieds, usually someone will post something about a ride. Here in SD they get called out by local riders and the ads removed since they just make things worse for people that really enjoy riding bikes.

While I've said this, and others since you posted, it depends where you are. In some cities children, highschoolers, college students, working professionals, middle aged parents with full grown children who wear suits to work everyday, addicts, homeless, messengers, hippies, commies, republicans, and democrats all get together and have a fun ride with minimal (with respect to the above video) anger and spread whatever message it is they ride for. In other cities CM is made up of mostly angry college students and messengers who want to do something and be heard. Many fall in the middle.

anger feeds anger! [...] "you'll get more with honey then you get with vinegar"

To step away from my previous Bible statement. Psychologists (especially those concerned with development and parenting) have empirically proven what you say. However, other psychologists (especially those concerned with emotions and clinical practices) have shown cathartic benefits to releasing anger. Anger is natural and trying not to feel anger will (also proven by psychologists) make you crazy. The trouble comes when releasing the anger causes harm. I do not see what type of harm the riders are causing by expressing their anger. The motorists expression of anger mangles bikes and crushes a riders foot. I consider that lucky as motor vehicle vs. pedestrian collisions usually result in more harm on the cyclists part than this one. The cyclists reaction to the motorists anger is more anger, which results in angering the motorist more and the cycle continues. Add in a bit of panic and not much happens other than people pissing each other off. Who was angry first? The cyclist or to motorist? See my previous post. In some cities CM riders are angry as they ride. However, what harm comes out of cyclists riding together angry? If nothing feeds the anger (such as driving into the mass) then it'll fizzle out, the mass will break up, and they might get a beer or two and talk about the mass. Sounds like stress relief without harm, which has been proven to be healthy.

In Response to All:

What I'm getting at in my (long) posts is that CM, even confrontational ones, can be viewed as a symptom of a problem rather than a problem itself. Something is causing these people to mass and cause a ruckus. One possibility is that they're sick of being

spit on, hit 3 times by cars, yelled at, cursed at, forced off the road into ditches and curbs, as well as many other unpleasantries while biking/commuting

and that blocking the evening commute once a month is the only way they can get their point across. While other mediums exist the problem has become urgent enough to riders that they feel a need to make the problem urgent to others as well. Other very rational views exist on CM, I'm presenting what my take is on the matter, and defending it with (admittedly academic) knowledge that I happen to remember when I make my argument. And if I'm succeeding, a few of you who read this will look at the thing a bit differently, but that doesn't mean you have to agree with me.

 

[Larry]

I wish no ill will towards any cyclist. I live on two wheels, usually bikes, sometimes motorbikes.

If critical mass happens, it happens. You can't block the roads with seven bikes and expect motorists follow slowly. If you had 100 or so then you're talkin critical mass, but for that little protest you should be respectful of other private citizens rights. In cali right now a bike is allowed a full lane if needed. I take it when I need it, I share the rest of the time. Those people who had their sleds run over shouldn't have been blocking the right of way for those vehicles. There's this mob mentality that takes over during critical masses that turns the most mild mannered person into a lunatic. I know I've been to many. I was even at the crazy one in San Franicsco in '96. When you have 5000 bikes you have a mass, you in your toyota tercel is gonna have to wait. If it's seven of you, you're gonna have to ask yourself, do you feel lucky? well, do you punk?

I usually only get to one or two a year, I simply can't stand disco bikes, and there seems to always be 2 or 3 at SF masses. There's always at least 2 bikes fitted with car horns too. It used to be pretty amazing to be on a mass and just here the chitter chatter, bells and hoots from massers in normally noisy downtown areas. DISCO BIKES HAVE RUINED CRITICAL MASS.

But then again, there's always cute girls at critical mass, so I'll be back. Probably this friday.

 

[socal_jack]

How did CM riders lose their status as .... Sapien Sapiens and become merely imitations of people?

When they abandoned the rule of law(both traffic and civil) and resorted to mob rule, plain and simple. If you saw the KRON clip or even the unedited version on Youtube posted by CM itself which is even less flattering as they harassed the ederly couple, it had lynch mob written all over it.

it's also entirely in the realm of possibility that there's a spaceship full of donkeys aimlessly hurtling through space and beaming root beer into the oceans of the universe.

And if there are, I would bet even money they act in a more civil manner than a CM ride and most likely better company to keep. Be that as it may, "donkeys aimlessly hurtling through space" is as good of a description of a CM ride as I've seen.

 

[Gold Street Customs]

Defense is common sense, not to get into the he said she said as far as politics of the ride but just like a motorcycle you ride like everybody is out to get you,again if a car is jumping a median self preservation says get out of the way and warn others.

 

[crt95]

I am a huge bike lover, and also a car lover. I have a lot of respect for people. But if someone wants to act stupid and get in my way of my truck there might be a critical splat. Just think if there was an emergency and someone had to rush a family member to the hospital. Protesting does nothing but just cause more problems and nothing gets solved.

 

[Anonymous]

That original video was great

Ignorance should be painful

 

[ponytailmike]

as always there is two sides to a coin.(and mabye a third if it happened to land on it's edge)
i've read a lot about the Critical Mass rides around the country and the world.
some do seem to be pretty bad. others seem to be just good fun.
i myself try to make it to all of the Critical Mass rides here in Kansas City.
there is usualy 60 to 100 people that show up.(even in 30 deg weather)
i think we have a good ride here and almost all the riders are just out for fun.
most cars honking their horns are also waving and giggling at the mass of bicycles.
riders are yelling "happy friday" and waving at any one and every one.
yes we do upset some people. their is no dought in my mind.
it's a good time. mabye here in Kansas City it's not the same as other places.
i made it 5 or 6 last year and 2 this year. i plan on many more.
these are just my thoughts.
and yes a lot of people do have some realy bad feeling towards the Criticla Mass rides.

ponytailmike
mike